Trump

[z929669]

snip/

I guess what I, and a lot of onlookers are bemused about, is a man that has shown himself to be: misogynistic, racist, arrogant, ignorant (on a few topics), politically inexperienced, tax-paying averse (although touted as the saviour of the economy) and speaks in a manner more akin to a salesman than a politician is the lesser of two evils! I guess the stench of elitism and cronyism is too strong on the Clinton side.

... so are the largest proportion of American voters (Trump actually lost the popular vote). Our electoral college and even state distributions of senators and lack of term limits and the weight of supreme court justices are all illogical ... except from the POV of the elite political class (it's chess to them). American voters seem pretty fickle to me, most of them seeming to sway from one candidate to the other almost daily and certainly weekly. Then you have the fact that the DNC was colluding with Clinton against Sanders. Collectively, Americans finally want to shut down the political class, and they probably would have elected Sanders if he hadn't been cheated out of the Dem nomination. Trump was the 'rebellion' vote, because he was the only choice for a lot of misguided people.

 

Groups do not function rationally, because they are collectively unintelligent --nearly half of Americans don't think the Earth is much more than 10,000 years old or that climate change is a grand lie. I could go on, but ... my guess that the same dynamic exists in the UK and Australia and many Western European nations (to greater or lesser degree).

[Guest]

.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Guest

[TehKaoZ]

Trying to watch the video but Youtube doesn't want to load.

 

This article sums up what is happening IMO

 

https://www.vox.com/2016/9/19/12933072/far-right-white-riot-trump-brexit

 

 

TL;DR White privilege & Xenophobia

[TechAngel85]

Honestly, I think if things don't improve politically within the next...say 10 years, we could see an overthrow of the government as our constitution allows for it. I think Z got a lot of it right. Trump was the "rebellion" vote against our current political and financial situation. I've heard many people say that Trump may be a terrible choice, but he's not an idiot and he is a brilliant business man that could help solve our $19 trillion debt.

[DoubleYou]

Groups do not function rationally, because they are collectively unintelligent --nearly half of Americans don't think the Earth is much more than 10,000 years old or that climate change is a grand lie. I could go on, but ... my guess that the same dynamic exists in the UK and Australia and many Western European nations (to greater or lesser degree).

I believe that the earth is less than 10,000 years old. I am a Christian. Please do not insult my intelligence.

[TechAngel85]

I'm a Christian, gay, and believe the Earth is several million to billions of years old. Most religious folk would tell me that's impossible. The point I'm making here without getting off track is even among religions there are varying views so saying or thinking it's a "Christian" thing is a fallacy.

[MonoAccipiter]

Not sure whether that is serious or not, DoubleYou, but a valid point to make either way would probably be that how old you think the earth is should have very little to say in determining your political acumen. 

 

@TehKaoZ: I don't think those two factors are enough to correctly assess the whole situation, and part of the reason for why the result was so shocking is perhaps that so much of the predictions were based on those two being the defining factors in this decision. It was clearly not, and if I remember correctly, the GOP side didn't actually garner much more votes than under Romney or McCain, but the DP side failed miserably compared with previous years. Meaning that this is more than anything a failing on the side of the DP, and less a success on the side of a campaign that did everything one would normally consider unwise (such as somehow managing to insult most minorities). Assuming the other side of the spectrum is xenophobic and privileged, will not really help us get anywhere. They are a factor, after all, hate crimes spiked in the UK post-Brexit, but I wouldn't say they're the defining factor. That seems a pointless generalization which leaves little room for some much needed introspection from the opposing candidate's political backers. Sparrowprince actually makes a very good point, although I would argue their solution to this disappointment is ridiculous, that does seem to be the general sentiment espoused by a lot of these voters. 

 

@TechAngel85: I don't think he's an idiot, but I strongly disagree that he's a brilliant business man. See some of the examples I listed previously. To me, this seems like the idea of him he's been selling to everyone since basically his first steps into the public eye. Just look at his speech patterns. How many times does he repeat that he is a great business man as opposed to actually showing real numbers on things, or offering up real solutions to queries? 

 

This man is an expert at selling an image he's been touting for so long he believes in it himself. Look at how he responded when he was asked about his leaked tapes: "I have the great respect for women. Women know I have great respect for them." He's 1: ascribing personality attributes to himself instead of acting in a way that would make others ascribe it to him, and 2: telling people what opinions other people have of him, not letting these opinions speak for themselves. The same act was repeated over and over throughout a long campaign. My personal favorite is "I know words, I have the best words." Again he's saying he is something, not showing he is something. This sentence is particularly amusing because none of the words he used in that or in the following sentence was anywhere close to being eloquent. 

 

EDIT: Posted at the same time as your last comment. That is very true.

Edited November 11, 2016 by MonoAccipiter

[TehKaoZ]

@MonoAccipiter

 

No your right, I wouldn't say it contains the whole picture. It's important to note that "white privilege" doesn't necessarily mean extremists (or even racist) but rather it is a fear that minority groups will gain more control over the government when the white majority has had power for pretty much the entirety of US history. Trump insulted quite a few minority groups and it's unlikely (I haven't checked statistics) that they had any part in him winning. Much of Trumps campaign has also been about putting fear into American people about outsiders be it Mexican or Muslims.  If you watch a few of his speeches you might start to think the entire country is on the brink of being invaded

 

An earlier post I made sort of broke down the kind of voters I think voted for him.

[z929669]

I believe that the earth is less than 10,000 years old. I am a Christian. Please do not insult my intelligence.

Seems like you may be joking, but in case you are not and for posterity:

 

First, I respect your Christianity and your right to your own opinions.

Second, you are obviously intelligent.

 

However, facts are not up for debate or subject to a belief system or opinions ;)

 

Agree with Tech: Most Christians have reconciled the factually-measured age of the Earth (~4.6 billion years) with their creationist belief systems. The two are not mutually exclusive.

 

... now, can we all agree that the Earth is flat, or do some of us really question the hard, all-but-provable logic of math and science? OMG, yes, some of us do!

 

---

... anyway, I am not one of those that thinks Trump has any more intelligence than the average guy (again, agree with Tech). I think he has been fortunate in his life, that's all (and he has personality going for him). He has a lot of gall, and he doesn't play the traditional political games. People have come to really hate politicians. Trump actually manifests all of the textbook behaviors of narcissistic personality disorder (according to many experts ... and me of course :D).

 

My personal mantra on politics: From the perspective of the governed, the desire to be a politician is itself the disqualifying agent for being a good one for the people.

[Fantomax]

Mind if I join in?

 

If you ask my opinion, both candidates are bad. Really (But, I'm not a Giant Meteor Fan). Hillary loves war and Trump has psycho-like way of thinking. The End.

[torminater]

I think this run for the presidency was far too much based on constrigated emotionalized opinions.

[Guest]

.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Guest

[Nozzer66]

Hey I'd vote for The Rock. He'd have to be better than the clown they just elected.

Edited November 21, 2016 by Nozzer66

[Guest]

.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Guest
Corrected video link

[Mandalay]

(sorry for my English)

 

As a belgium guy, i was surprised two weeks ago in Vegas. i was there for a IT Security Convention (Intel security). The first day i discussed with a woman that manage a very good mexican restaurant on the strip.

 

i was surprised by these facts

 

she spent 10 years as an illegal worker in the U.S.

she was made US Citizen three years ago by the way of an Obama initiative

but she wanted to vote for TRUMP

 

for me,with my european mind, it was a little bit difficult to understand so i asked her very politely if she could explain me that case

 

her answer was very simple. i'll resume this like..

 

"As i am now a us Citizen, i feel that i must vote"

"i will never vote for a democrat women that accept to receive so much money from banks for so small speech"

"i want to see things changing. better a bad change than nothing"

"i don't trust in Clinton"

 

This resume well the situation. US mind looks sometime like alien for us. But i'm sure that it's the same in the other way.

 

Mandalay