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Dyndolod causes CTD on loading screen


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#16 sheson

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 05:17 AM

Even when I don't click the checkbox for Beyond Bruma when generating Dyndolod worldspaces, I still get errors pertaining to missing meshes from Beyond Bruma at the bottom of the Dyndolod generation window. Thinking that might be the culprit, I deactivated Beyond Bruma and my Requiem patch when generating, but the game still crashed on loading save.


If the plugin of a mod is loaded when DynDOLOD starts, its base records and whatnot are still part of the process, regardless if you generate for its world spaces or not.
 

So I'm sitting here trying to think logically. It seems to be Tamriel related. Now I've deleted Tamriel worldspace from Dyndolod and the game loads. I ran around. No crash. Which at least solves the Solstheim issue.


Find a 100% reproducible case and concentrate on it and narrow it down. The goal is to end up with data causing crashes that has everything else removed.
 

Taking a look again with xEdit, I noticed some records aren't being carried over. Things like XCLR - Region, MHDT - Max Height Data, XCWT - Water, Editor ID, and then there were some Record Flags from new USLEEP not being displayed in Dyndolod.


What do you mean records are not carried over? When DynDOLOD creates an overwrite record, it uses the data from the last overwrite before it at the time.
 

Since I'm grasping at straws right now, I decided to forward everything over as much as I could into Dyndolod.esp and mark as many entries as possible in green (except Max Height).... Then I checked Dyndolod.esp for errors. There were a few Moveable Statics with <Unknown: 6> in  the Record Flags, where I removed the Unknown entry. And it still crashed.


FAQ: Checking for errors for DynDOLOD.esp with xEdit
A: .. \ Record Flags -> <Unknown: 6> are intentional and can be ignored.
 

Which makes it seem you are correct in that there is some situation with meshes/texture? What are your thoughts? Which log should I provide if need be?


Now it seems your tests and crash reports are all over the place. Does it crash before, while or after loading the game? Does it crash once you are in the world?

If it is all of the above, focus on one of the crashes. Again. If you removed something that eliminated the crash, go back one step and remove something else that does not eliminate the crash until nothing else is left.

The log ..DynDOLOD\Logs\DynDOLOD_TES5_log.txt just upload to paste bin or something.
 

Unfortunately I wonder if there are crashes outside of those Blocks since I have not tested anything beyond Falkreath/Riverwood/Whiterun.


Don't wonder, stick to that one crash you can reprodue 100%. If you there more areas, chances are high they are related and if we find the cause of one they all will be fixed.
 

I stripped everything from the aforementioned Blocks except Tamriel_ShesonObject, Tamriel_Minion_* and Tamriel_FirstBorn_* references.

The game loads the save now but will freeze/crash as soon as I enter a new cell unless I delete those blocks. No errors exist in the Dyndolod esp but who knows, there could be more issues out of the blocks I deleted.


Again then go back one step and remove something else that doesnt remove the crash. It will be quicker that way.

If you can load into the world and run around and it then crashes, check the papyrus log after setting "debug":"true" in DynDOLOD_Worlds.json

Upload the papyrus log as well if you like.

Edited by sheson, 08 November 2017 - 05:19 AM.

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#17 nicktheduke

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Posted 09 November 2017 - 08:04 PM

You're right. I'm going in circles after so long but I haven't given up even though I might have lost a few hairs on my head. I took another look at only Dyndolod.esp. Decided to take a different route. Instead of deleting the temp cells (which even when deleted would sometimes cause CTD), I started deleting things from Persistent which resulted in, well... no crash. At least in the Falkreath/Riverwood/Whiterun areas... Or at least a few times. So here's where I'm at:

 

1.

+ I went ahead and started a new game

+ I start without Dyndolod activated on a test character in ASLAL, save once I'm outside Talos Gate Pass starting area (Mercenary from Hammerfell start)

+ I console player.setav speedmult 300 (so I don't push the game engine too far) and start running from Talos Gate Pass to Helgen to Riverwood to Whiterun

= game does not crash

 

2.

+ I quit and reload game with Dyndolod.esp activated, as it was entirely generated

= crash on loading the save without entering game

 

3.

+ I delete everything Skyrim.esm-related in Persistent of Dyndolod

+ Load game with that version of Dyndolod

= Game LOADS without crash

+ Message appears that Dyndolod initialized and MCM added as I run around

= game freeze/CTD as I approach Helgen from Talos Gate/Falkreath

 

4. 

+ Revert back to original generated Dyndolod.esp

+ I reverse and delete everything EXCEPT Skyrim.esm and Tamriel_*-related

+ Message appears that Dyndolod initialized and MCM added as I run around

= game freeze/CTD as I approach Helgen

 

5.

+ Revert back to JUST Skyrim.esm and Tamriel_*-related Dyndolod (#4)

+ Take a deep breath

+ Delete everything tree-related from Skyrim.esm in Dyndolod

= game does NOT crash approaching Helgen

+ Testing futher, I console coc Whiterun and run back towards Riverwood

= game freeze/CTD

 

6.

+ Having failed, I revert back to entirely generated Dyndolod

+ Since the game did not crash after deleting tree-related and since I crashed near Whiterun (WR*), I delete everything related to those in Dyndolod

= crash on loading the initial save near Talos Gate without entering game

 

7.

+ Revert back to entirely generated Dyndolod

+ Start a new game

+ Open a beer

= sit here and cry as I realize that I have no idea what to do next

 

8. 

+ New game

+ This time I save in ASLAL interior cell nowhere near Whiterun/Helgen/Riverwood/Falkreath

+ Reload with entire Dyndolod

= crash on loading save

 

 

-----

 

I looked at my Papyrus log a few times. Nothing Sheson/Dyndolod/mesh/texture-related comes up missing or in error. Just scripts for Req_CACO and some other stuff.

 

This is my Papyrus if I save in ASLAL cell and load save with entire Dyndolod activated: https://drive.google...4E71zAF-AZTxTa6

Here is Dyndolod_Tes5_log.txt - https://drive.google...iew?usp=sharing

 

Please help if you can. Thank you for your patience.


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#18 sheson

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 06:44 AM

2./8. When exactly is that loading crash, when loading starts before some 3D model/trivia is shown, in the middle while the model/trivia still shows or at the end after model/trivia faded away but before you hear any sounds of the world?
What happens when you coc whiterun from main menu instead of loading and existing game.
 
3. Skyrim.esm-related = green overwrites of records form Skryim.esm?
 
5. tree-related from Skyrim.esm = the overwrite base records in TREE?
 
7. We should be able to figure it out eventually.
 
Whenever you have a crash while running around in the world, set "debug":"true" in ..skse\plugins\StorageUtilData\DynDOLOD_Worlds.json and see if the very last message(s) in the papyrus log are from SHESON_LODObject(s).
While the game is loading the scripts are just setup but not executed and no models are enabled/disabled yet. The crash may be the same cause, but the papyrus messages won't help us at that stage yet.
 
When the last message(s) in papyrus log are not about a LODObject, check with Skyrim Performance monitor if the exe hits over ~3.1GB RAM limit or if VRAM usage is exceeding/near real memory of the graphics card.
 
Here is what to try next:
I am assuming you generate Medium on the advanced screen with maybe additional options checked.
 
Next time generate just Low from the main screen.
If that doesn't change anything, generate Low from the advanced screen with "Generate DynDOLOD" unchecked.
 
Let me know if that changed something.

Edited by sheson, 10 November 2017 - 06:45 AM.

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#19 nicktheduke

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 09:23 AM

2/8. The crash on loading save occurs immediately after the smoke/trivia appears, but no 3D model. When I coc Whiterun, the smoke/trivia/3d model appear for a brief second, but the game freezes and eventually crashes.

 

3. Not the green overwrites, the new records generated by Dyndolod that are Skyrim.esm-related contained in Persistent

 

5. Anything in Persistent that starts with TREE in the name (not Editor ID)

 

7. Thank you.

 

With the Windows 10 DX9 update + a 1080ti, is the ~3.1GB RAM limit valid any longer? ENB says I'm a little over 20GB of Memory when game loads.

 

You're correct I'm using Medium settings from advanced screen with a few additional options checked. My settings are based off SRLE LOTD Req'd guide here: http://wiki.step-pro...ied/Finish_Line with Shrine of Azura added to LOD.

 

So I tried changing my settings to Low with the Wizard on main screen. It no longer crashed. I ran from Talos Gate to Helgen to Riverwood almost to Whiterun. I quite literally jumped for joy. I then decided to test Wizard on Medium. The game loads when I start a new game. I run towards Helgen but it freezes. 

 

Right now I'm comparing the Low and Medium esps to see what has been added that causes CTD.


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#20 nicktheduke

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:17 AM

Hm. There's not much difference in ESPs. Any thoughts?


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#21 nicktheduke

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 10:59 AM

At this point, should I just say screw it and go with Low setting since it works?


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#22 sheson

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 12:41 PM

With the Windows 10 DX9 update + a 1080ti, is the ~3.1GB RAM limit valid any longer? ENB says I'm a little over 20GB of Memory when game loads.


TESV.exe can not use more than ~3.1 GB RAM. We all the ENBoost and tools, updates that is still true, those just moved as much stuff possible out of that process.
 

Hm. There's not much difference in ESPs. Any thoughts?


The problem could be from a single record or mesh. Start by comparing base records in Activator, Container, Door, Furniture, Movable Static, Static and Tree
Start with new ones only in the esp that end with *_DynDOLOD_LOD.
I would start by looking for records that only exist in medium that point to meshes NOT in ..dyndolod/lod/ or ..lod/

If you find such a base record (and you let xEdit build the reference info to show which reference use it), remove all associated references from the worldspaces to see if there is a difference.

 

At this point, should I just say screw it and go with Low setting since it works?


That depends on your desire to spend more time troubleshooting or more time playing, I wont mind either way :)

Edited by sheson, 10 November 2017 - 12:42 PM.

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#23 nicktheduke

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 12:42 PM

Nevermind. I tried playing with Low setting. While it did play, it froze upon approaching Helgen. I reloaded and entered game but it crashed when another cell was loaded on my way to Helgen.


Just saw your post. Going to take another look and see if I can find something. Thanks again


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#24 sheson

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 05:51 PM

Neverfroze upon approaching Helgen. I reloaded and entered game but it crashed when another cell was loaded on my way to Helgen.


Then do that "debug":"true" in ..skse\plugins\StorageUtilData\DynDOLOD_Worlds.json and check papyrus log.
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#25 nicktheduke

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 09:27 AM

Hehe. The hits keep on coming...

 

Ok I decided to just go ahead with low settings. Got to Helgen. Went into the Keep. Boom there's things missing like cabbages and clutter and then I look to my left and there's huge chunks of walls and floors missing. So frustrating that I just gave up. I went to sleep and this morning I looked at what was affecting interior cell of HelgenKeep01. Couldn't find anything out of place so I started clicking on things with MFGconsole. Eventually I found a torch that was last affected by... you guessed it, Dyndlod.esp

 

When I deactivate Dyndolod.esp, the walls and cabbages are back where they should be. Obviously this is weird. Dyndolod doesn't affect interior cells and does not have anything listed in the esp that I can see. I even regenerated Dyndolod without Temporary=1 

 

Any thoughts?


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#26 nicktheduke

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 11:38 AM

I decided to try a new game with Medium settings using Wizard. I can get outside of ASLAL cell where Requiem and scripts kick in. Dyndolod initializes. As soon as I start moving the game crashes, but at least I'm outside. I saved before freeze/CTD but when I try to load that save again, the game crashes on loading screen.

 

I've got the Papyrus logs here with debug on in Dyndolod_world.json:

https://drive.google...RYfKLgBg5Lf12_d


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#27 nicktheduke

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 12:08 PM

I tested again using the Low settings Dyndolod. Like I mentioned, the game loads and I can enter Helgen Keep but there's weird things missing.

 

Here's the Papyrus: https://drive.google...JJb0sacOzOmR3ig

 

There's something of note:

 

Error: Cannot call GetWorldSpace() on a None object, aborting function call stack:
[ (FE00528C)].SHESON_DynDOLOD_LODObject.OnCellDetach() - "SHESON_DynDOLOD_LODObject.psc" Line 248
[11/11/2017 - 12:04:05PM] OnCellLoad called, bLocked:False
[11/11/2017 - 12:04:05PM] Error: Cannot call GetName() on a None object, aborting function call stack:

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#28 nicktheduke

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 12:31 PM

So there was some Dyndolod "patches" for something I can't remember. I disabled and tried another new game using Low settings. Instead of entering Helgen Keep, the game crashes... 

 

Papyrus log:

https://drive.google...5xpgdFfzC8ziRks


Edit: it was a Caranthir Tower Reborn and Lanterns of Skyrim patch that includes meshes/textures/scripts

 

I am going to rebuild on Low without these and see what happens


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#29 sheson

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 01:05 PM

Hehe. The hits keep on coming...
 
Ok I decided to just go ahead with low settings. Got to Helgen. Went into the Keep. Boom there's things missing like cabbages and clutter and then I look to my left and there's huge chunks of walls and floors missing. So frustrating that I just gave up. I went to sleep and this morning I looked at what was affecting interior cell of HelgenKeep01. Couldn't find anything out of place so I started clicking on things with MFGconsole. Eventually I found a torch that was last affected by... you guessed it, Dyndlod.esp
 
When I deactivate Dyndolod.esp, the walls and cabbages are back where they should be. Obviously this is weird. Dyndolod doesn't affect interior cells and does not have anything listed in the esp that I can see. I even regenerated Dyndolod without Temporary=1 
 
Any thoughts?


This makes no sense whatsoever. DynDOLOD does not modify any interior cells. That a some random object base record has a flag set by DynDOLOD is just coincidence.
Even if there would be something going with that base record of that torch, that should not affect the base record of cabbages or the references placing a cabbage. Considering that there are 10,000s other users with the same modifications to the base records and who still have cabbages showing, something else must be happening.

Random nonsense like this if often the result of something hitting a limit. There once was this iLargeIntRefCount INI setting, to address issues with lot of things in interiors, but I am not sure if it still applies.

What happens if you remove the torch overwrite? What is the form id of the torch?

 

I decided to try a new game with Medium settings using Wizard. I can get outside of ASLAL cell where Requiem and scripts kick in. Dyndolod initializes. As soon as I start moving the game crashes, but at least I'm outside. I saved before freeze/CTD but when I try to load that save again, the game crashes on loading screen.
 
I've got the Papyrus logs here with debug on in Dyndolod_world.json:
https://drive.google...RYfKLgBg5Lf12_d


OK, we can rule out that those meshes listed there are causing problems, as there are 4 seconds between the last LODObject script entry and the last line of the log. Mesh problems are causing immediate CTD so that there is usually no time for other things to be printed to the log after a mesh was enabled. Darn.

 

I tested again using the Low settings Dyndolod. Like I mentioned, the game loads and I can enter Helgen Keep but there's weird things missing.
 
Here's the Papyrus: https://drive.google...JJb0sacOzOmR3ig
 
There's something of note:
 
Error: Cannot call GetWorldSpace() on a None object, aborting function call stack:
[ (FE00528C)].SHESON_DynDOLOD_LODObject.OnCellDetach() - "SHESON_DynDOLOD_LODObject.psc" Line 248
[11/11/2017 - 12:04:05PM] OnCellLoad called, bLocked:False
[11/11/2017 - 12:04:05PM] Error: Cannot call GetName() on a None object, aborting function call stack:


That message can happen when you introduce a DynDOLOD to a save game in an exterior. Is that what you did? It is inconsequential. Use save game in interior or new game/coc from main menu for tests.


Since this is still all over the place and still seems very random, I would try to remove batches of plugins and their patches/merges. If possible I would start with flora/fauna/alchemy mods that affect all worldspaces, or if easier remove single large new land/quest mods for generally reducing resource usage.
However, it maybe be easier to just enable group of mods/plugins from low to high priority. E.g. start with vanilla and all meshes/textures mod that have not plugins. Since the problem is even with low, just generate low for Tamriel and do your usual test.

Maybe that reveals something more logical and repeatable. If you somehow manage to make a small load order with the error still present that you could zip (just DynDOLOD.esp and maybe merged.esp if needed) and send to me for further testing.


 

So there was some Dyndolod "patches" for something I can't remember. I disabled and tried another new game using Low settings. Instead of entering Helgen Keep, the game crashes... 
 
Papyrus log:
https://drive.google...5xpgdFfzC8ziRks

Edit: it was a Caranthir Tower Reborn and Lanterns of Skyrim patch that includes meshes/textures/scripts
 
I am going to rebuild on Low without these and see what happens



Those patches update the scripts of those mods. If I remember correctly, the Lanterns scripts runs twice a day and the Caranthir Tower scripts only run when the show/hide spells are casted.

Edited by sheson, 11 November 2017 - 01:08 PM.

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#30 nicktheduke

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 02:11 PM

Yeah this is very weird. I've used Dyndolod for years now and I've never encountered any problems with it.

 

Decided to reinstall Dyndolod just to be safe. Regenerated on Low with all worldspaces except Beyond Bruma. Ran game without Dyndolod at first. Saved in Helgen Keep. Everything good to go. Loaded game up with Dyndolod inside Helgen Keep. Everything still looks fine. I walk out. Dyndolod initalizes. Walk back into Helgen Keep. Crash on loading cell.

 

Took your advice. Generated *only* Tamriel. The game loads. I exit Helgen Keep. Dyndolod initializes. I go back into Helgen Keep. No crash with all the cabbage and walls there.

 

Any thoughts? Why does having the other worldspaces involved cause Dyndolod to CTD?

 

Currently going to try turning off chunks of worldspaces being generated to see if that might fix it.


Edited by nicktheduke, 11 November 2017 - 02:17 PM.

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