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Survival (by Smile44)



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#1 Smile44

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 04:12 AM

This is a standalone pack for making exploration of the environment of Skyrim more challenging both outside and in. Additional notes are added to make this pack compatible with Requiem.

It includes mods that many people use such as frostfall, Realistic Needs and Diseases, Cloaks etc..

It also adds in changes to traps because lets face it vanilla traps can be a surprise if you are not looking (they are really obvious in game) but are unlikely to cause you much of a problem other wise. Traps should be deadly and hard to spot, in that way exploring ruins and dungeons becomes a good deal more immersive.

This pack is compatible with all other packs I have added as well as SR:LE, STEP CORE and Extended.

I will update this post when the page is complete.

:)

Pack is live now.

NOTE: I have not included "Wet & Cold", it is a very good immersive mod but can tax the game engine somewhat so this is an option that is included in STEP Extended.

EDIT: I have added "Fires Hurt" by abot. This fits in nicely with the ethos of this pack - You need to eat and drink, you need to wrap up in the cold, you need to avoid traps and try to avoid standing on or too close to a fire in order to survive in real life so works for me in Skyrim.
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#2 z929669

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 04:14 AM

This is a standalone pack for making exploration of the environment of Skyrim more challenging both outside and in. Additional notes are added to make this pack compatible with Requiem.

It includes mods that many people use such as frostfall, Realistic Needs and Diseases, Cloaks etc..

It also adds in changes to traps because lets face it vanilla traps can be a surprise if you are not looking (they are really obvious in game) but are unlikely to cause you much of a problem other wise. Traps should be deadly and hard to spot, in that way exploring ruins and dungeons becomes a good deal more immersive.

This pack is compatible with all other packs I have added as well as SR:LE, STEP CORE and Extended.

I will update this post when the page is complete.

:)

Please name this "Survival"

We need to avoid adding Author name and "Pack", as these are redundant, and apostrophes might break things (not sure about that yet though).

Pack threads need to be named explicitly after the Pack page name for clarity. (and don't forget to ad the "Pack" tag)

See new thread title.

#3 Smile44

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 05:15 AM

The reason for adding my name to the pack name is so that it is not suggesting that it is an official pack for STEP. I don't mind if you want to remove this from the title. Also there is another survival pack in the works although what the eta on that is or how it will vary from my basic pack I don't know. :) EDIT: I have changed the name to Survival.
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#4 tehherb

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 05:28 AM

It's coming along, mostly been testing for stability before I finalise the list (well finalise the initial list). would you perhaps want to discuss our ideas and maybe create a pack together if there is little variance? Seems a little silly if we end up having two fairly similar packs.
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#5 Smile44

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 05:41 AM

Sure, part of the reason I am getting these up there is to get the ball rolling and generate some testing and ideas etc.. My packs work well together as they are but I do not in anyway assume that they are good as they could be. I have used all of these mods in a variety of installs for a long time, what I am basically doing is grabbing stuff from my modlist and adding them into separate packs. Let me know your thoughts on how you would add to or change what I have done and we can then compare notes. It's all good. :)
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#6 z929669

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 11:50 AM

The reason for adding my name to the pack name is so that it is not suggesting that it is an official pack for STEP. I don't mind if you want to remove this from the title. Also there is another survival pack in the works although what the eta on that is or how it will vary from my basic pack I don't know.

:)

EDIT: I have changed the name to Survival.

STEP official Packs with be named "STEP:Survival", etc. ;)

Also, your table headings:
"Add into 2I Clothing and Equipment", etc.

... this will be confusing to users, who should already have installed STEP:Core. Instructing them to add this to that section will be the question "Do I need to reinstall STEP:Core now?"

I think that it is best to not use the STEP Section IDs at all. Go ahead and use the names if you want though, so the above becomes:
"Clothing & Equipment"

#7 Smile44

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 02:12 PM

I don't think that is remotely confusing. - Step Core should already be installed and the instruction is to add this or that mod to that section in their install. Still I'll make the change and a number of others to keep things consistent. :wacko:
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#8 z929669

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 03:08 PM

I don't think that is remotely confusing. - Step Core should already be installed and the instruction is to add this or that mod to that section in their install. Still I'll make the change and a number of others to keep things consistent.

:wacko:

you are asuming that everyone is using MO or Wrye Bash and that they are experienced modders. Without explicit instructions on the concept of installation order and how these mod managers work, it will definitely beg that question or similar/related ... over and over, believe me.

All the user needs to do is install your Pack mods LAST in their install order (think of those doing manual installs).

#9 Smile44

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 03:43 PM

That is not always going to work as some mods need to be overwritten by others - not necessarily the case with these packs but I think the dedicated NMM user of the past is not ready to manage a major mod install. Besides NMM is apparently about to gain functionality similar to MO in terms of profiles and mod management - if it hasn't already. So these potential problems will fade. People doing manual installs and I have done many in the past, really need to plan their mod install order before installing. This is partly why I asked about the format for packs in that not all versions can easily be installed after STEP CORE in their entirety, take STEP Extended for example. If someone manually installs STEP CORE and then decides to add STEP Extended they are going to run into problems with the conflicting graphics section straight away. Not to mention other texture mods down the line. To make this work a manual installer will need to decide what their whole modlist will look like before they start to install STEP otherwise they will have a whole heap of problems. I would completely advise users not to manually install STEP because it makes it almost impossible to update, rearrange, optimize etc.. STEP is after all something of a fully operational work in progress like the Death Star in Return of the Jedi. :) Any attempt to get a large modlist to work together is going to entail something of a learning curve part of which is the use of the various mod tools detailed and recommended at the start of the guide. If you don't learn to use the tools then you can't build the house. :) EDIT: B&$$er changing the names completely removed the modlists and all text. Not doing that again today. EDIT 2: got the tables back along with the old names which is definitely the lesser of two evils. Will look at this heading malarky another day.
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#10 z929669

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 04:14 PM

That is not always going to work as some mods need to be overwritten by others - not necessarily the case with these packs but I think the dedicated NMM user of the past is not ready to manage a major mod install. Besides NMM is apparently about to gain functionality similar to MO in terms of profiles and mod management - if it hasn't already. So these potential problems will fade.

People doing manual installs and I have done many in the past, really need to plan their mod install order before installing. This is partly why I asked about the format for packs in that not all versions can easily be installed after STEP CORE in their entirety, take STEP Extended for example. If someone manually installs STEP CORE and then decides to add STEP Extended they are going to run into problems with the conflicting graphics section straight away. Not to mention other texture mods down the line.

To make this work a manual installer will need to decide what their whole modlist will look like before they start to install STEP otherwise they will have a whole heap of problems. I would completely advise users not to manually install STEP because it makes it almost impossible to update, rearrange, optimize etc.. STEP is after all something of a fully operational work in progress like the Death Star in Return of the Jedi. :)

Any attempt to get a large modlist to work together is going to entail something of a learning curve part of which is the use of the various mod tools detailed and recommended at the start of the guide. If you don't learn to use the tools then you can't build the house.

:)

EDIT: B&$$er changing the names completely removed the modlists and all text. Not doing that again today.

EDIT 2: got the tables back along with the old names which is definitely the lesser of two evils. Will look at this heading malarky another day.

Not so for STEP:Core (we assume anyway, and that is what alpha testing will help to determine with regard to specifics). We have constructed STEP:Core to minimize downstream conflicts and *problems* associated with that. For add-on Packs, this concern of *breaking the game* is unwarranted. For complex overhauls, I agree, but let's takle that once we explore how far Packs can go on top of a STEP:Core base.

We want to know the explicit "issues" with regard to add-on Packs right now. If you encounter any potential, please specify them explicitly so that we know beyond the intuitive/assumptive statement above.

STEP:Extended is not yet finalized and we do not make any assumptions about being able to install Packs on top of STEP:Extended (or any other modded setup other than pure STEP:Core ... that is why we constructed it the way we did ;) ).

I am pretty certain that STEP:Core users could install all of this Pack as last in their install order on top of STEP:Core. Information gleaned to the contrary will give us reason to examine the idea of pulling specific mods from STEP:Core. Also, Pack-specific patches can deal with any special cases like adding a Pack as a final install to to other common mod setups liek STEP:Extended or STEP:Core with certain Packs already installed.

EDIT: I renamed the tables accordinly and deleted redirects. We will need to add in a link to the subpages containing the Pack Tables (will hold off on that until we know what other changes are needed, as everything is interconnected).

#11 tehherb

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 06:34 PM

Smile commented that renaming a mod list reset it I'd like to back that up, it happens for me to. Same as if I change the title being visible or not, resets table data.
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#12 z929669

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 09:14 PM

Smile commented that renaming a mod list reset it I'd like to back that up' date=' it happens for me to. Same as if I change the title being visible or not, resets table data.

Yes, if you rename a mod list, then the existing reference no longer points to the valid mod list page. That page also needs to be moved. Mod list pages reside at:

PackName/ModListName

I will need to create a link to that in the SMW structure. For now, you can either avoid renaming then, rename then and try to figure ti all out (which is good too, as it helps you guys/gals understand the mechanism ;) ), or I will go in and tend to this stuff a bit later.

FYI, These use cases will go along way to helping us work out the kinks later, so we really appreciate you guys pushing through this stuff and sticking with it!



#13 Smile44

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 01:27 PM

New mod added to this - see OP. :)
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#14 Xaviien

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Posted 11 March 2015 - 12:05 PM

Hi Smile,

 

Just wanted to say thanks for making this pack. I was looking to add some survival mods on top of Extended, and got overwhelmed with all the options, and this mod recommending that mod, which recommends this other mod. That's when I thought to myself "Hey, I wonder if there is a STEP pack for this stuff".

 

One thing I noticed, the description for Fires hurt says "No special instructions let BOSS sort it." Should BOSS be changed to LOOT? I got worried for a second and thought I'd need to start using yet another utility.

Also the forum link on the wiki was old and pointed somewhere random. I updated that for you.


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#15 Smile44

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Posted 13 March 2015 - 01:27 PM

Yes that would be fine, LOOT is probably great for all the mods in this pack if using with STEP. SR:LE uses BOSS though so you will need to follow BOSS rules where they apply in this pack, that said SR:LE pretty much has all of this anyway.

 

::):


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