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Shadow Optimization


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#31 DoubleYou

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 11:36 PM

On my rig just enabling use graphics in ENB cost around 5-7 FPS (if I remember right) without any effects enabled. That was with custom fx files though, maybe something isn't disabled properly. But the shadow fixing alone would be worth it imho.
 
If you are on a low end machine you can optimize FPS because high quality ENB shadow filters+lower resolution shadows look better then higher resolution shadows without ENB (or lower ENB shadow settings).
 
I would still be interested if you can see a shadow quality difference related to the lod switching bug (maybe you found a fix for it?). If you set the shadow distance to 3000 you should be able to reproduce it by changing FOV back and forth from 75 to 80 ingame.
Hmm, I'm thinking it was a recent tweak I made that made it seem like ENB shadows didn't have much fps impact, as I seem to be 5 fps faster or so now back with regular shadows. I'll have to run a benchmark. ENB shadows do look good, but they really don't look that much better than my tweaked ones.
 
Can you find me shadow settings that do show the fov-lod bug? It simply doesn't occur for me. Tried lowering fshadowdistance to 3000 and switching from 75 to 80 and nothing changed at all.

Looks like I may have drawn the wrong conclusions that it was fShadowDistance causing that "bubble effect". After watching this video, I think it was fShadowBiasScale.     Here's my shadow related settings:   [Display] iBlurDeferredShadowMask=7 fInteriorShadowDistance=2500.0000 fShadowDistance=2500 iShadowMapResolutionSecondary=2048 iShadowMapResolutionPrimary=2048 iShadowSplitCount=2 fShadowLODStartFade=200.0000 iShadowMode=3 iShadowMapResolution=2048 fShadowBiasScale=0.16 iShadowMaskQuarter=4   My goal is to get rid of jumpy/Jaggy/blocky shadows while not killing my FPS.   I have the LOD switch set: fTreesMidLODSwitchDist=6000.0000

I think that's why I have fshadowbiasscale up so high at 1

#32 Spock

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Posted 09 June 2014 - 07:05 AM

 

Hmm, I'm thinking it was a recent tweak I made that made it seem like ENB shadows didn't have much fps impact, as I seem to be 5 fps faster or so now back with regular shadows. I'll have to run a benchmark. ENB shadows do look good, but they really don't look that much better than my tweaked ones.
 
Can you find me shadow settings that do show the fov-lod bug? It simply doesn't occur for me. Tried lowering fshadowdistance to 3000 and switching from 75 to 80 and nothing changed at all.
I think that's why I have fshadowbiasscale up so high at 1

Supposetly vanilla shadow settings should cause it. I had it if I deactivated ENB, but since I use ENB I didn't bother looking any further. My shadow distance is 8000.

 

On a r9 290 the ENB shadows cost less then 1 fps, even on highest settings. UsePatchSpeedhackWithoutGraphics=false alone did cost the fps, even with all effects disabled. I cannot test anything atm, it may be some shaders in the fx files, it may be ENB intercepting API calls. I asked a friend of mine to take a look at the shaders and see if anything is running, but that probably takes a while as he is even lazier then I am. And then I just had another idea, maybe it was deffered rendering.


Edited by Spock, 09 June 2014 - 07:18 AM.

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#33 Simondererste

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:47 PM

Linked to this thread instead of the YOU CAN HELP link which leads to an 404(i guess the forum transition caused some dead links). Don't know if this thread was meant but couldn't find something similar.


Edited by Simondererste, 17 June 2014 - 12:48 PM.

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#34 thaiusmle

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 01:23 PM

 

 
Hmm, I'm thinking it was a recent tweak I made that made it seem like ENB shadows didn't have much fps impact, as I seem to be 5 fps faster or so now back with regular shadows. I'll have to run a benchmark. ENB shadows do look good, but they really don't look that much better than my tweaked ones.
 
Can you find me shadow settings that do show the fov-lod bug? It simply doesn't occur for me. Tried lowering fshadowdistance to 3000 and switching from 75 to 80 and nothing changed at all.
I think that's why I have fshadowbiasscale up so high at 1

 

@DoubleYou - Can you share you shadow setting? Thanks.


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#35 DoubleYou

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 04:05 PM

@DoubleYou - Can you share you shadow setting? Thanks.

I already did in post #16.

Linked to this thread instead of the YOU CAN HELP link which leads to an 404(i guess the forum transition caused some dead links). Don't know if this thread was meant but couldn't find something similar.

Thanks. It was indeed this thread. Fixed.



#36 CovertSlinky

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 10:21 AM

Ok, this thread needs some love :) I am about to test these things out myself and see what I prefer. Right now I don't have that bubble effect, although I have seen it before. But what one weird thing I am getting since making adjustments to the ini's for shadows per the nexus guide listed earlier in this thread, "skyrim stability guide". I get this strange white glowing aura that is casted a small radius off of my players head whenever I ride a horse, it radiates out and in with the bobble effect from riding the horse, it is really weird.

 

@DoubleYou Are you still using the ini shadow tweaks? Or have you went to enb shadows?

@Spock did your friend ever get anywhere with that test you wanted him check? 


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#37 Telessa

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 10:22 AM

I would love if there was a thread where everyone would post their Skyrim.ini, SkyrimPrefs.ini, ENBLocal.ini, and even the SKSE.ini along with their system specs.  Then folks like me, "The INI Challenged", could come take a look and get some tips on setting up the ini files to get the most out of our systems and this game we all love.  There would be questions of course, but there would be many who will just read the posts to gain an understanding regarding ini files and settings.  I "know" my SKSE.ini is right only because I have a wonderful friend that leads me around by the hand showing me how to do this that and the other.  

 

I know it would be impossible to say "this is THE way your SkyrimPrefs.ini should be and here is your end all, do all, be all Skyrim.ini".  I may be totally confused and clueless when it comes to what all those letters jumbled up together mean and what I should put in as a value but even I know there cannot be one definitive .ini for all users.  (AA, FAA, FXAA, AF, and on and on!  Gads, it's enough to make a person go completely mad trying to figure out what all those mean, let alone what they do or what the values should be!)

 

I "think" I have my "must be" values set as Dan has helped me along with all of it (bless his very, very patient heart ♥) but I also have a lot of other settings that I have absolutely no clue as to what they should be or even if they should be.  What is really needed in an .ini and what are the so so entries?  I have been guilty of reading a mod description that suggests this or that change and blindly making the changes because I "thought" I probably needed to because the mod author included it in the description.  The author wouldn't have noted the changes if they weren't needed.  Right?  To that I say HAH!  Sometimes they include changes because they were told they needed it not realizing it really depends on the users system setup.

 

It's very frustrating when one knows so little about what does and doesn't need to be in each .ini setup as well as the value for each of them.  So perhaps just a general "this is my system" settings post to the main thread "Suggested INI settings" or some such thread subject so it could be easily found.  And as I said, if everyone would post their system specs and their ini settings for the 4 main ini files, it would really help those of us who are clueless.

 

I dunno if it's anything that the admins would consider allowing on the forums and then contributing to the thread.  We look to a handful of users, including the admins here, for their vast knowledge of the game and things to do that help when our games seem broken.  We trust what you say and, as for me, I've learned so much by reading your responses and threads.  I've never posted a "thanks" thread for all the information I've gotten from this forum by those who are deeply time invested in the game but you've all helped me so much.  I mean, just look at S.T.E.P. how cool is that!!  I think that an ini thread would really help many of us get not only an understanding of the entries that are included, as well as the values that are set per each user's system setup.

 

Just thinkin', and wishin' and hopin' :D  I've read at least 20-30 articles and thread posts regarding what those letters all mean and how we should or shouldn't set them up.  But honestly, it all sounds Greek to me and my eyes glaze over around the 3 article/post that I read.  I try really hard to concentrate and take notes but....... OH!!!  Look!!  A bunny!!   :blush:

 

Thanks for reading and perhaps even considering,

Ciao! ♥


Edited by Telessa, 12 August 2014 - 10:28 AM.

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#38 DoubleYou

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 05:15 PM

Ok, this thread needs some love :) I am about to test these things out myself and see what I prefer. Right now I don't have that bubble effect, although I have seen it before. But what one weird thing I am getting since making adjustments to the ini's for shadows per the nexus guide listed earlier in this thread, "skyrim stability guide". I get this strange white glowing aura that is casted a small radius off of my players head whenever I ride a horse, it radiates out and in with the bobble effect from riding the horse, it is really weird.

 

@DoubleYou Are you still using the ini shadow tweaks? Or have you went to enb shadows?

@Spock did your friend ever get anywhere with that test you wanted him check? 

Still using my shadow settings, although I think I upped the blur a bit. I still haven't tested shadows extensively, as I want to know what every setting does before I'm satisfied.

 

The light around the player I normally associate with  antialiasing, but I'm not sure.



#39 redirishlord

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 05:40 PM

"I would love if there was a thread where everyone would post their Skyrim.ini, SkyrimPrefs.ini, ENBLocal.ini, and even the SKSE.ini along with their system specs.  Then folks like me ... could come take a look ..."

 

I used the "About me page" of my STEP Profile to add "spoiler tabs" containing my skyrim.ini, skyrimprefs.ini and current LOOT load order & TES5Edit merge script patch contents. This information is in no way guaranteed, use at your own risk, blah blah blah, but FWIW there it is.


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#40 Telessa

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:19 PM

"I would love if there was a thread where everyone would post their Skyrim.ini, SkyrimPrefs.ini, ENBLocal.ini, and even the SKSE.ini along with their system specs.  Then folks like me ... could come take a look ..."

 

I used the "About me page" of my STEP Profile to add "spoiler tabs" containing my skyrim.ini, skyrimprefs.ini and current LOOT load order & TES5Edit merge script patch contents. This information is in no way guaranteed, use at your own risk, blah blah blah, but FWIW there it is.

Thank you so much!! I"m going to go look and see how they compare to mine.  I'm so clueless when it comes to knowing what to include in the inis as well as what the settings should be.  I know much of it is system dependant, but I know there are lots that are graphical as far as the game goes too and I have no clue about them!  So thank youi! I'm off to take a look!!

 

You rock!

Ciao! ♥


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#41 redirishlord

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:37 PM

So, remember, STEP ini tweaks = stable. My current tweaks = potentially dangerous work in progress.

You shouldn't make any changes you don't understand (I'm saying that as much for my benefit as yours), but I'm happy to compare notes & / or in-game experience.


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#42 Telessa

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:43 PM

Oh I wouldn't change anything just willynilly! LOL  I do have one question though, you have your iPresentInterval=1 set in both your Skyrim.ini and your SkyrimPrefs.ini.  Does it need to go in both places?  I've only ever had in my Prefs.ini.... was that incorrect?
 
I'm going to keep looking and reading to see what you have compared to what I have.  Our systems are different so I know a lot of the settings are based on that and the graphics cards... :D  It's nice to look though and get an idea of what goes where and what other's ini files contain.
 
Thanks for posting yours!
 
Ciao! ♥


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#43 redirishlord

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:53 PM

I believe you are correct on my iPresentInterval=1 set in my Skyrim.ini, that is most likely unnecessary. The enblocal memory values are a recent change, seems to be working well so far but needs additional stress testing. I also turned off the Edge AA in enblocal and have my Nvidia Control Panel running its own 32xCSAA & 16x AF (assuming that's working as expected), and turned off the Vsync in enblocal as well (to use Nvidia adaptive setting).


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#44 Telessa

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 07:13 PM

I believe you are correct on my iPresentInterval=1 set in my Skyrim.ini, that is most likely unnecessary. The enblocal memory values are a recent change, seems to be working well so far but needs additional stress testing. I also turned off the Edge AA in enblocal and have my Nvidia Control Panel running its own 32xCSAA & 16x AF (assuming that's working as expected), and turned off the Vsync in enblocal as well (to use Nvidia adaptive setting).

I changed the memory value and fired up my game and it seemed to be working as well.  I always wondered why it was set so low... that was a setting that made more sense to me than the vanilla values.  But we shall see :D  

 

I'm still trying to figure out what all the other stuff means so I can get a better idea of what changes to make, if to make them, when mods say to do this that or the other.  Can't just blindly follow along anymore, I get tired of "fixing" my game LOL

 

Thank you for your input RedIrish, I really appreciate it!

 

Ciao! ♥


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#45 CovertSlinky

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 10:40 PM

Hmmm, I'll have to look into the aa as for my bug. I have your settings in for shadows atm, I don't mind them, they are subtle, but don't look terrible either. Will be doing some of my own testing on this soon. We really just need more collective information about the "Shadows of Skyrim" (oh, yup, I just copyrighted that :p), then a silver bullet for the shadows, seems like most info on the web you find are do or die settings, to much of one setting and not enough of another, mostly cause you can't get the settings fully optimal. Seems like it is another one of those tweaks that needs to be done per user for desired/preferred result.


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