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Installing Omod's with Mod Organizer

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#1 antonio4198

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Posted 31 August 2014 - 12:03 PM

I wanted to use Mod Organizer with Oblivion and i'm trying to install Qarl's Texture Pack 3 but they are all OMOD's. So Mod organizer doesn't recognize them. Anybody know how to convert it or something so i can install them with Mod Organizer?


Edited by antonio4198, 31 August 2014 - 12:04 PM.

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#2 DoubleYou

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Posted 31 August 2014 - 12:46 PM

I've always run OBMM through MO to install omods. Kinda tricky, but it works.



#3 hishutup

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 03:51 AM

Personally, I would like full OMOD archive support but like what double you said:

Run OBMM (TMM) through MO

Install mod normally and allow all overwrites.

 Ini edits get tricky. Just remember which mods have ini edits. Some edits may cause crashes if the mod is removed

After the mod finishes installing close the application.

In MO right click the overwrites

create mod

and there you go



#4 pStyl3

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 05:31 PM

I am in the process of starting to mod Oblivion aswell, and I want to use MO for it. Cleaned the official DLC plugins, and thanks to GSDFan I already could successfully setup OBSE .. Fast Exit 2 is working great (as advised I put this OBSE plugin directly into Oblivions Data folder).

 

What I would like to know .. instead of OBMM, couldn't I use Wrye Bash's BAIN to install .omod's aswell? As far as I have understood it, that should be possible (haven't used BAIN before, OBMM neither) .. and seeing as I need to use WB for the Bashed Patch anyway I kind of wonder why I still should use OBMM; why use three mod manager if I can use only two? Is there any advantage of OBMM over WB that I don't see, or a feature that only OBMM has?


Edited by pStyl3, 05 September 2014 - 05:36 PM.

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#5 DoubleYou

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 05:48 PM

Does Wrye Bash support OMODs?



#6 hishutup

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 06:35 PM

nope I need to do monitor external installation for it to work... It works pretty good BUT if you do get it to work I am unsure how well...

 

EDIT: MO has many troubles down the road. Especially with external applications... GL with UL patches, wizard FTW

fast exit is included with OSR

OBMM was superseded by TesModManager

 

Wrye Bash does CRC and has wizard support... Its complicated but once you have a ton of individual mods you'll understand why I talked Red into WB even though it does have a bunch of issues.

AND don't use that qarls use this one... The omod one is incomplete

http://www.nexusmods...on/mods/44772/?


Edited by hishutup, 05 September 2014 - 06:45 PM.


#7 pStyl3

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Posted 06 September 2014 - 06:41 AM

Okay, after reading your comments and Tes4Mod:Bash vs. OBMM (I'm also currently reading STEP Guide:Wrye Bash, not yet finished though), I see that .omod's can't be installed directly through BAIN. In case to make this work .omod's need to be repackaged into BAIN-friendly archives .. the question would be, how much work would that be and .. would it be worth it over an alternative like OBMM & Co.
 
Regarding OBMM, okay let me list a few things, to get this right.
 
- Oblivion mod manager - OBMM by Timeslip
- Oblivion Mod Manager Extended by Scent Tree
- obmm extended with Skyrim support by monpetitbeurre
- TesModManager - OblivionModManager for Skyrim - Oblivion and Morrowind by monpetitbeurre
 
 
So indeed, [color=#ffa500;]TesModManager[/color] seems to be the most recent mod manager of these four, making the previous three - including the original OBMM - obsolete.

 

fast exit is included with OSR

Oblivion Stutter Remover includes Fast Exit 2? Where do you see that? I do not see any information regarding this, so I would've thought that I should use both alongside each other.
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#8 hishutup

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Posted 08 September 2014 - 02:12 AM

You only need OSR... Plain and simple... You can even do a test yourself.

 

There a lot of "fixes" out there that are not needed. Just be aware.

 

And the Bash vs OBMM seems out of date... meaning some things have changed.

 

Omods are archives themselves. Its easier to do the install procedure I have described above.

 

The reason I use Wrye Bash is because of many reasons that are pretty hard to describe...

uninstalling a mod with files that overwrote another it will reinstall the previously overridden files

visually see installed mods, patches ( this can be a real pain if a mod is Load Order aware)

wizard.txt support

directly edit the archives (7zip)

monitor external install (.exe support)

etc...

 

 

and wyre bash having OMOD support... I see people claim that it does but its never worked for me


Edited by hishutup, 08 September 2014 - 02:14 AM.


#9 pStyl3

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Posted 10 September 2014 - 06:23 AM

Thank you for your help! I have uninstalled Fast Exit and installed Oblivion Stutter Remover, and as you said it works, no more crash on exit with OSR aswell.

I will use MO as main mod manager, WB for Bashed Patches and TMM for .omod's.
OBSE plugins will be installed directly into Oblivions [font="'courier new', courier, monospace;"]..SteamSteamAppscommonOblivionDataobseplugins..[/font] folder, so they will not be managed via MO.


I now have installed the following mods:

- Oblivion Stutter Remover
- MoreHeap
- 4GB Patch
- Unofficial Oblivion Patch
- Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch
- Unofficial Official Mods Patch
- OBSE -Elys- Universal Silent Voice
- Blockhead
- Oblivion Character Overhaul 2
- Qarls TP3 for NMM (+UOP-QTP3 Patch)
- Underworld armor


So far everything seems to work, the textures seem to be applied correctly (Archive Invalidation is activated through MO) .. see these screenshots regarding QTP3: before - after


I am also aware of these three mods:
- CTD and Memory patch ENBoost
- Memory purger - extended
- Streamline

but for the moment I will "only" rely on OSR, MoreHeap and the 4GB Patch. As long as I don't run into any stutters or frame rate drops those three should be enough.

Edited by pStyl3, 10 September 2014 - 06:27 AM.

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#10 hishutup

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Posted 10 September 2014 - 06:40 AM

moreheap is unneeded... OSR also does heap replacement but needs to be configured (turned on)

 

streamline is tricky to config correctly.... BUT there is a memory purger (cell buffer) included with Streamline

 

Stutter is tricky because theres many parts:

     Memory swapping

     hardware limit

     engine limit

memory can kinda be fixed with iPreloadSizeLimit

Hardware is unlikely to be reached

The engine is the main culprit. You can test it yourself with Really AEVWD. My GPU usage hangs around 30% while my FPS is 15.

 

I do know Oblivion has a memory leak... It grows pretty quick but most people shouldn't hit the top. It takes like 6 hrs for 2 GB RAM

 

The goal of my guide is to have a good feel to the game. Not slow, laggy, etc. but at the same time be fully loaded with a broad choice of mods.



#11 pStyl3

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 06:11 PM

I did some testing. With the setup from above I get the following results (I used SPM, it works with Oblivion aswell):

 

 

 

 

After installing Really AEVWD and running TES4LODGen.exe (based on xEdit 3.0.33 svn1808), i get these results:

 

 

I gotta say, I wouldn't have thought, how MUCH of an impact that mod is. ::P: Oblivion really seems to be engine-limited. I mean neigher my GPU nor my CPU are maxed out (far from it), my vram isn't maxed out aswell .. and yet, my average fps drops from 59 to 43 .. the framerate drops are pretty aweful at times, if you are outside of cities.

 

True, I installed everything from RAEVWD, that might be to much overkill for this engine. Can you suggest anything to disable, hishutup, something where the win/loss ratio is low?

 

 

 

 

Regarding [color=#FFA500;]MoreHeap[/color] .. skyranger-1 said here this (he is refering to MoreHeap):

 

 

 

No. That does not change the heap algorithm, it just changes the size of the initial memory block reserved for the secondary heap (provided by windows) used in the game. Which might help slightly on heavily modded games or longer game sessions. OSR actually rips out the primary heap (written by Bethesda) and replaces with a completely different one.

Using both at the same time is reasonable if you have LAA / 4GB enabled.

 

 

And when this was brought to shademe's attention, he wrote this:

 

 

 

If SkyRanger says OSR and MoreHeap can be used together, then I'd use them together.

 

I see in the comments of both pages that some say, that OSR overwrites the changes MoreHeap does .. but truth be told, if both authors say that it can be beneficial to use both mods then I am gonna use both mods. I would like to see hard evidence that MH doesn't help the slightest if I should remove it .. otherwise, like said .. I trust the authors comments regarding this.

 

 

 

 

That said. RAEVWD really does hit the Oblivion engine hard, and OSR+MoreHeap+4GB Patch cannot prevent fps drops. I'm gonna add Streamline and/or ENBoost to that list to check whether or not those will make a difference .. if not, then I will either uninstall RAEVWD partially .. or completely. Will see about that.


Edited by pStyl3, 14 September 2014 - 05:38 AM.

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#12 hishutup

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 04:40 AM

as for the more heap thing you can do both... you can replace the algorithm and/or change the size

but hey I am just looking at the setting in OSR like below 

OSR ini

Heap = {iHeapAlgorithm = 6iHeapSize = 768

the default size for Oblivion is said to be 450

Generally the size doesn't matter but it definitely helps with 

 

The game is definitely engine limited, poorly optimized, etc... thus on modern hardware, it performs sub-par

It was developed for 512MB AGP cards(not 100% sure about this)

but it was developed for shader model 2.0 with some 3.0 but cards at the time had trouble even with 2.0... current is SM 5.0

Thats why I left it out... I can't get above 30 FPS even with

[General]uGridDistantCount=15

the above tweak is not UGridsToLoad... So, don't get those two confused

 

Take a look though what my guide is in the current state... Its kind of a mess but it's slowly getting cleaned up and Im about halfway. Then I have to do conflict resolution

 

I have yet to figure out what causes frames to dip

Since, you're using a 780ti, I can guarantee you won't see 50% of the card be utilized

The engine doesn't have a problem with 4K res... Downsampling works pretty well 0 frame drop

You can even inject smaa

 

Streamline is a pain in the a**... I need to get more into it

As for monitoring whats going on... I look at my keyboard... Its got an LCD on it that MSI can use

 

Oh.. As for most modern hardware most of the performance tweaks don't work.

Like the sound thing

 

But water reflects do a good amount + the distant thing


Edited by hishutup, 14 September 2014 - 04:41 AM.


#13 pStyl3

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 06:10 AM


Thats why I left it out... I can't get above 30 FPS even with

[General]uGridDistantCount=15

the above tweak is not UGridsToLoad... So, don't get those two confused

I did another test and changed  [font="'courier new', courier, monospace;"]uGridDistantCount=25[/font]  to  [font="'courier new', courier, monospace;"]uGridDistantCount=15[/font]  aswell (nothing else was changed). Result:

 

 

The average fps rate is now 53, so better than 43 but still not 59 like before RAEVWD was installed.

 

Haven't tested Streamline/ENBoost yet .. I do that once I have the time to do so.

 

 

 
Oh.. As for most modern hardware most of the performance tweaks don't work.
Like the sound thing

What "sound thing" are you refering to?


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#14 hishutup

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Posted 14 September 2014 - 09:58 PM

Way back when...

People were having issues with Oblivions sound causing massive game lag...

Disabling the sounds help people...

That doesn't work anymore.

 

honestly, I am surprised that you even get 53 FPS, mine drops to about 20 in some areas till streamline starts to reduce the distance on some things then it increases back to 40ish

When I tried Really AEVWD out it was just unplayable... As the guide matures I or someone else will find the quirks

I might try a clean install and see what I get for FPS...


Edited by hishutup, 14 September 2014 - 09:59 PM.


#15 pStyl3

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Posted 15 September 2014 - 03:22 AM

Thanks for the explanation.

 

53 fps average are generally good, but outside of cities that doesn't help much either, as they don't "feel" that good. With RAEVWD activated I get massive fps drops nonetheless, even if they are short .. and that's noticeable. I often find that more disturbing than, for example, having "only" 40 fps stable all the time.

 

Regarding Streamline .. haven't tested it yet, but I downloaded it and read the readme. I really doubt that it will help, as for one, I don't want it to reduce the visuals .. I only would be interested in the Streampurge function, which is than again "only" an automated pcb (PurgeCellBuffers) console-command; if I understand it correctly. And that doesn't help me with my problem the slighest, as the problem is not over time overflowing cell buffers - with RAEVWD the fps drops are happening right from the start.

 

ENBosst though .. that I will definitely test. It can do some great things for Skyrim, same should be true for Oblivion.


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