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STEP v2.2.0 Official Bug Reports Thread


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#16 Cestral

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:57 PM

I've come across quite a few people that don't seem to know what the "Baseline" column means. I've also noticed a substantial increase in TPC Light downloads since the new STEP was released, so I'm thinking many people download the baseline versions without really knowing what it is. I believe the reason for this is that many skip reading the first pages and go straight to the mod lists. Not sure if you should change it to "performance" or how it could be clarified, or if it is even necessary. Yeah, I know, RTFM, but unfortunately many don't.
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#17 z929669

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 10:50 PM

I've come across quite a few people that don't seem to know what the "Baseline" column means. I've also noticed a substantial increase in TPC Light downloads since the new STEP was released, so I'm thinking many people download the baseline versions without really knowing what it is. I believe the reason for this is that many skip reading the first pages and go straight to the mod lists.

Not sure if you should change it to "performance" or how it could be clarified, or if it is even necessary. Yeah, I know, RTFM, but unfortunately many don't.

I am in favor of leaving it and pointing to this post ;) Although, I am gestapo when it comes to RTFM ... no mercy. This way, at some point it becomes common knowledge that the STEP Guide is much more than a mod list. :yes:

#18 frihyland

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:12 AM

We knew this was gonna happen from the start and made every effort to inform our users, I'll likely write up a paragraph to be inserted in between each table for 2.3 that will reiterate that if they are just following the instruction in the table they are not actually installing STEP but an extremely bastardized version of maybe 40% of the potential quality.
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#19 Besidilo

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:51 AM

I'm all for people reading the whole guide, but there are many out there who don't have much time for modding/playing games, and the installation process is time consuming enough for them to be easily put off. So I think anyone starting with section 2.A. of the guide and finishing with 2.F. should be able to install the core STEP without any issues. With that said, a quick note under Installation Table - Header Definitions would do.
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#20 frihyland

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 05:48 AM

I'm all for people reading the whole guide, but there are many out there who don't have much time for modding/playing games, and the installation process is time consuming enough for them to be easily put off.

So I think anyone starting with section 2.A. of the guide and finishing with 2.F. should be able to install the core STEP without any issues. With that said, a quick note under Installation Table - Header Definitions would do.

The guide is 29 pages for a reason, there is 10 pages of fluff (first 9 and very last), the rest is a dense description of how to mod Skyrim without breaking it and if you are skipping it you are gonna have problems, period.  I think that we should work out a way to incorporate all the installation data (12 pages) into and in between the mod tables (7 pages) for a uniform experience that doesn't allow skipping.

Its already there. People don't even read the page that tells them how to interpret the tables...
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#21 Cestral

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 12:20 PM

Yeah, well, I don't know if this is a "suit yourself" issue or if it's better to spoon-feed the users. You usually have to go through great lengths if you are to cover every possible mistake or confusion when so many people are using something.
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#22 z929669

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 02:31 PM

I'm all for people reading the whole guide, but there are many out there who don't have much time for modding/playing games, and the installation process is time consuming enough for them to be easily put off.

So I think anyone starting with section 2.A. of the guide and finishing with 2.F. should be able to install the core STEP without any issues. With that said, a quick note under Installation Table - Header Definitions would do.

The guide is 29 pages for a reason, there is 10 pages of fluff (first 9 and very last), the rest is a dense description of how to mod Skyrim without breaking it and if you are skipping it you are gonna have problems, period.  I think that we should work out a way to incorporate all the installation data (12 pages) into and in between the mod tables (7 pages) for a uniform experience that doesn't allow skipping.

Its already there. People don't even read the page that tells them how to interpret the tables...

Good idea to interleave the mod tables with the other "must-read" content. however, people will still manage to only look at the mods and install them each without giving any attention to the supporting doc.

This is fine with me, as they will most certainly get a result commensurate with the time spent following the guide. The guide is only as good as the person following it, and making it foolproof is just not possible. Further, catering to the lazy costs MUCH more effort with almost no ROI :P

#23 frihyland

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 03:13 PM

I don't doubt it, but I feel it will make the info more accessible for the people that are putting in the effort and that's a worthy cause.
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#24 Neovalen

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 03:46 PM

This is whats wrong with the world, catering to the least common denominator... Darwin is rolling in his grave! :D
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#25 Korentin

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 06:49 PM

In your mod testing forum Neovalen posted this: "Despite the fact that it's recommended in the CK bug fixes area here, for some reason the ini tweak iLargeIntRefCount=999999 causes Helgen Keep to crash my game. I haven't found any other areas specifically bugged by this tweak, there is probably an epic bug of some type in the worldspace there. Removing the tweak allowed Helgen Keep to load fine. Just putting this out there in case anyone else runs into it. I did put the tweak back in after exiting Helgen." I'd just like to comment that I ran through the vanilla start with that tweak and did not have any problems with it (or anything else for that matter ;) ), so its probably not something caused by the tweak itself. I did not, however, have a full STEP install at the time.
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#26 Neovalen

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 07:23 PM

I have plenty of mods on top of my STEP install but I could not pin it to any one mod... after hours of debug. As said, just an informational item in case people run into problems.
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#27 Korentin

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 07:29 PM

[quote name=''Neovalen' pid='12674' dateline='1347063794']I have plenty of mods on top of my STEP install but I could not pin it to any one mod... after hours of debug. As said' date=' just an informational item in case people run into problems.[/quote']

Yep, read your mod pages :) Just thought I'd add my experience with it as well.
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#28 Stejo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 01:34 PM

Hey there. Thanks for the effort you put in creating this project. I just wanted to air my frustration over trying to follow your guide repeatedly to no avail. Let it be noted that I'm by no means an inexperienced user nor lazy to read the various guides and faqs you put together. I first encountered the STEP project a couple months back, when I returned to Skyrim for Dawnguard release. I had never modded Skyrim before. STEP seemed great but it was outdated at the time and after spending 3 days trying to install it's various suggestions I ended up with an unplayable installation and gave up. Now with the release of v2.2 I thought I'd give it another go. But after a few hours of tinkering around I'm already starting to give up hope. While I think it's great that you try to explain how everything works and what the various options are to set up the different mod managers or ENBs, it ends up being too timeconsuming and ambiguous to set up and it kinda defeats the purpose of the project in the first place, which was to let players spend their time actually playing the game instead of endlessly modding it. And since -the way I understand it- STEP breaks every couple months due to game and/or mod updates and every new release requires a vanilla setup and specific order of installation, I really can't see why you don't include a premade mod setup and masterlist archive in the project that would go on top of a vanilla installation and bring the game exactly where it would be if the guide was followed to the letter. I don't know if mod authors would object to such a collection or if hosting the archive would present a problem, but I'm sure a torrent file would solve the hosting problem very easily. In any case, I just wanted to say that it would make my life (and probably many others' too) so much easier if such a quick install option was to be created. Just my 2 cents and thanks again for all your hard work, regardless of my own inability to see it realized.
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#29 Besidilo

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 02:06 PM

Hosting a mod collection without the authors' permissions would be both illegal and unethical. It's not going to happen, but I agree that STEP should have a "lite" version of the guide, that has a straighforward installation of all the recommended mods listed in a clear and edible way. I've already suggested this to the STEP team, we'll see how it goes. Regarding your instability, it would be beneficial if you tested your mods setup every time you install a few core mods to be sure. I recommend Alternate Start mod for quick testing with a new game each time, seeing if anything breaks. STEP 2.2 mods should have no conflicts anyway.
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#30 z929669

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:14 PM

Hey there. Thanks for the effort you put in creating this project. I just wanted to air my frustration over trying to follow your guide repeatedly to no avail. Let it be noted that I'm by no means an inexperienced user nor lazy to read the various guides and faqs you put together.

I first encountered the STEP project a couple months back, when I returned to Skyrim for Dawnguard release. I had never modded Skyrim before. STEP seemed great but it was outdated at the time and after spending 3 days trying to install it's various suggestions I ended up with an unplayable installation and gave up. Now with the release of v2.2 I thought I'd give it another go. But after a few hours of tinkering around I'm already starting to give up hope.

While I think it's great that you try to explain how everything works and what the various options are to set up the different mod managers or ENBs, it ends up being too timeconsuming and ambiguous to set up and it kinda defeats the purpose of the project in the first place, which was to let players spend their time actually playing the game instead of endlessly modding it. And since -the way I understand it- STEP breaks every couple months due to game and/or mod updates and every new release requires a vanilla setup and specific order of installation, I really can't see why you don't include a premade mod setup and masterlist archive in the project that would go on top of a vanilla installation and bring the game exactly where it would be if the guide was followed to the letter.

I don't know if mod authors would object to such a collection or if hosting the archive would present a problem, but I'm sure a torrent file would solve the hosting problem very easily. In any case, I just wanted to say that it would make my life (and probably many others' too) so much easier if such a quick install option was to be created.

Just my 2 cents and thanks again for all your hard work, regardless of my own inability to see it realized.

I agree that STEP is a time-consuming install; however, from your post, I assume that you are not following all instructions and that you are skipping over vital information. Take special care to follow the SIG instructions regarding Steam installation and Skyrim installation. Ensure that you can run vanilla with all STEP options configured prior to installing any mods.

I suspect that the pre-mod config is where you are running into trouble.

patience is a listed STEP requirement :yes:


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