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Using FNIS and mods that have 'creature specific' animations

fnis animations bugs

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#1 GrantSP

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Posted 26 September 2015 - 07:27 PM

Whilst trying to track down an issue with another user from LL, (don't ask me what the mods are, you really don't want to know.) we noticed an odd behaviour regarding animations and how they are saved in MO after you run the FNIS tool.

 

Normally when you run ANY tool in MO the files that exist already in the VFS are updated and any NEW files that are created are sent to 'Overwrite', where you can decide if they need to made into a mod or discarded. This is how everyday FNIS use is when we add mods that have animations that affect the actor or the player's character or NPCs.

 

Now when you add a mod that has creature animations, such as the ones in the initial situation, (considering the site they came from you can imagine what they contain  :O_o: ) FNIS somehow handles these differently and the resultant *.hkx files are actually saved into the MAIN FNIS mod and are now active in EVERY profile that you have FNIS active.

This is completely different to PC & NPC animations where you can have the FNIS output from 'Overwrite' made into a profile specific mod that can be de/activated at will.

 

What this means is the MAIN FNIS mod is now changed to contain animations specific to those mods and if those plugins necessary for those animations are not active, such as in another profile or if you remove those mods, you will have frozen or T-posed creatures in your game.

 

How to fix this situation?

 

The first thing you might consider is to run the "De-install creatures" function from inside the FNIS tool. This will in fact remove these newly created animations from inside the MAIN FNIS mod but it also removes the *_TEMPLATES specific to each creature from inside the FNIS -- Creature Pack, necessary for the functionality of these mods.

This means if you want to install another mod that also has creature animations FNIS will complain that Creature Pack is missing, despite the fact the mod is still installed. MO is unaware that the TEMPLATES inside it have been removed.

So, after running the "De-install creatures" function you MUST re-install the FNIS -- Creature Pack.

(Now after bringing this to @fore's attention he has agreed to change the functionality of that button to leave behnd the TEMPLATES, but this won't be in place until the new version of FNIS is released.)

 

Here is my MO log from running FNIS with a creature animation mod installed.

Here is the Bug Genie report that is now closed because @tannin can't see how it is related to how MO's code works.

 

What we need to do is see if it is in fact an error caused by the code in FNIS or MO and then bring it to the attention of either author.

We also should consider re-evaluating the install instructions of FNIS inside MO to avoid this issue. There are possibly a few ways this can be avoided.

 

The biggest problem is the MAIN FNIS mod contains the tools needed to update the animations. The original soultion posed by this user was to have multiple installs of FNIS, specific to each profile. Whilst I originally criticised this idea it does now look to be a good option, except for the need to update multiple copies of the mod with each new FNIS version and then ensure the shortcuts to those tools are correct each time. Very problematic.

 

Splitting the FNIS install into two: tools and scripts in one mod and the basic meshes in another unfortunately doesn't work since running the tool still places the new *.hkx files into the mod that contains the FNIS tool, not the one with the meshes, thus defeating the purpose of splitting them.

 

What anyone that uses FNIS, to provide creature animations needs to do, is re-install the Creature Pack each time after choosing "De-install creatures", at least until the new FNIS version is released.

 

If anyone can think of a clean and easy way to maintain profile specific versions of the FNIS mod, please post here as I am currently devising a "simple" method for all MO users to run this tool.

Or if you can pinpoint the error as from either FNIS or MO let me know and we can get either author to change it.

 

EDIT: 1)

I just now tried to make an already existing mod that contains the various creature animations and have that active alongside the FNIS -- Creature Pack. No change, although the established MO behaviour would dictate these already existing files would be UPDATED, new files are again place inside the MAIN FNIS mod. Very weird.

I've PMd @fore to get some input into how he has his code working, ie. does NPC & PC animations have to be treated differently to creature ones, and whether his code specifically treats them as different and if so why.

Further both @Greg and myself are examining the VB code for it, to see if there is some trick to this odd behaviour.

 

EDIT: 2)

Looking at the MO logs seems to show that the FNIS code uses variables for the paths used by actor animations but it uses commandline functions to go back through the directory tree twice before saving the files in the meshes folder when dealing with creature animations.

It is shown thus:

DEBUG (09:35:56.0227): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\atronachstormcharacter.xml" "..\..\meshes\actors\atronachstorm\characters\atronachstormcharacter.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking

compared to this:

DEBUG (09:35:51.0557): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\defaultmale.xml" "defaultmale.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking

I still can't see why MO would follow that and place them in that folder and not the 'Overwrite' since none of these files exist beforehand in the VFS.



#2 Greg

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Posted 26 September 2015 - 11:01 PM

The only difference I see, and I haven't dug into this aspect of it too deeply yet, is that the default animations are created in in the default folder whereas the creature animations are created in the specific folder where they belong. I need to go back through that initial animation generation logic to determine how defaultfemale.hkx and defaultmale.hkx end up in the final directory.

 

DEBUG (19:00:41.0339): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\0_master.xml" "0_master.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking

 

DEBUG (19:00:44.0269): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\defaultfemale.xml" "defaultfemale.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking

 

DEBUG (19:00:44.0809): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\defaultmale.xml" "defaultmale.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking

 

DEBUG (19:00:45.0409): create process (w) null - ".\hkxcmd.exe" convert -v:WIN32 "temporary_logs\atronachflamebehavior.xml" "..\..\meshes\actors\atronachflame\behaviors\atronachflamebehavior.hkx" (in C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Skyrim\data\tools\GenerateFNIS_for_Users) - hooking


#3 Greg

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Posted 26 September 2015 - 11:33 PM

I just fixed it in the current code. It turns out when hkxcmd.exe creates the files with this path, Mod Organizer mistakenly places the files in the main mod folder. This doesn't make any sense at all, but whatever...

 

The solution is to create the files in either the current directory or the temporary_logs directory (the same way it generates defaultmale.hkx and defaultfemale.hkx) and the move the files to the final folder. I sent you the code change via PM.



#4 GrantSP

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Posted 27 September 2015 - 06:20 PM

Just now compiled those changes and it works beautifully. :woot:



#5 GrantSP

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Posted 09 October 2015 - 08:45 PM

@fore has just released v6.0b1 of FNIS that uses some of the ideas gleaned by this testing, and also the suggested code modifications, and it now correctly handles the 'Creature' specific animations.

Upon running FNIS ALL animations will now be found in the "Overwrite" folder where they can be handled appropriately by the user.



#6 randomnessincarnate

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 02:37 PM

@fore has just released v6.0b1 of FNIS that uses some of the ideas gleaned by this testing, and also the suggested code modifications, and it now correctly handles the 'Creature' specific animations.

Upon running FNIS ALL animations will now be found in the "Overwrite" folder where they can be handled appropriately by the user.

is it still working for you? reason i ask is it was working for me around november 2015 then computer broke and i finally have a new one but fnis won't work again and keeps saying creature pack not installed

 

please tell me what you need to help me i wouldn't want to spam you with logs until i know they would help i tried googling creature pack not installed but i can't find any links that will work


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#7 Greg

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 02:41 PM

In Mod Organizer, make sure all FNIS and animation-related mods are checked (enabled) in both the left and right panes. If one of the mods isn't checked, FNIS won't be able to find it. Also make sure you are running GenerateFNISForUsers.exe from within Mod Organizer.



#8 randomnessincarnate

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 03:20 PM

In Mod Organizer, make sure all FNIS and animation-related mods are checked (enabled) in both the left and right panes. If one of the mods isn't checked, FNIS won't be able to find it. Also make sure you are running GenerateFNISForUsers.exe from within Mod Organizer.

wow that was really fast i feel bad for making you wait i am so used to people taking longer and i did that already the only ones that aren't are in the left side so they won't appear in right side  but if there causing problems just by being uncheckmarked i can always delete them and reininstall when i need/want them also i always run everything through mo and i have comp set up so mo always run in admin mode


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#9 randomnessincarnate

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 09:19 AM

is there any other questions to be answered? or more info? wasn't sure if  you are able to help me fix the error and also how do i know whats causing it is it mod organizer? or should i talk to fore about it? want to make sure


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#10 Nebulous112

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 11:00 AM

Try having MO not run as administrator. Just keep it out of your program files on C drive.

Could be a permissions thing maybe, if FNIS doesn't have administrator level permission.

#11 randomnessincarnate

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 01:01 PM

problem is that if i run mo in regular mode then nothing works and it says i can't detect python or the other stuff plus when i run fnis outside of mo i get a error from fnis saying it was installed badly


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#12 Nebulous112

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 01:33 PM

Where is MO installed? If it's in your program files on your C drive, that is the problem. Install MO in a new folder outside of program files, like "C:\Games". Or if you have another hard drive or SSD, anywhere on there (D drive).

Also, you should always run FNIS through MO. Check the original post in the sticky thread in this forum named "Using FNIS with MO" or something similar.

#13 GrantSP

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 05:57 PM

problem is that if i run mo in regular mode then nothing works and it says i can't detect python or the other stuff plus when i run fnis outside of mo i get a error from fnis saying it was installed badly

If you run MO as a regular user, as you should, and it is telling you it can't find certain files or executables that's because they are restricted by Admin privileges. As soon as you run MO with Admin privileges it will fix those issues but then impose other errors on your setup, possibly the one you have now.

 

So firstly you can safely disregard the Python error messages. MO only uses Python for a few small plugins in its tools and it also comes with a bundles subset of Python when you install it. Easiest thing to do if those messages annoy you is to disable the Python Proxy in the settings: Settings -- Plugins -- Python Proxy / enabled == false.

 

Now, as to the "Creature Pack" error. When you installed this mod did you ensure it was installed into a mod all its own and not merged into the FNIS main mod? If it is a separate mod ensure it is both below the FNIS main mod and checked in the left pane.



#14 randomnessincarnate

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Posted 04 January 2016 - 08:25 AM

Where is MO installed? If it's in your program files on your C drive, that is the problem. Install MO in a new folder outside of program files, like "C:\Games". Or if you have another hard drive or SSD, anywhere on there (D drive).

Also, you should always run FNIS through MO. Check the original post in the sticky thread in this forum named "Using FNIS with MO" or something similar.

sorry didn't know you would respond so soon and yes i installed it on the d drive since thats the closest thing i have to a ssd i think

 

 

If you run MO as a regular user, as you should, and it is telling you it can't find certain files or executables that's because they are restricted by Admin privileges. As soon as you run MO with Admin privileges it will fix those issues but then impose other errors on your setup, possibly the one you have now.

 

So firstly you can safely disregard the Python error messages. MO only uses Python for a few small plugins in its tools and it also comes with a bundles subset of Python when you install it. Easiest thing to do if those messages annoy you is to disable the Python Proxy in the settings: Settings -- Plugins -- Python Proxy / enabled == false.

 

Now, as to the "Creature Pack" error. When you installed this mod did you ensure it was installed into a mod all its own and not merged into the FNIS main mod? If it is a separate mod ensure it is both below the FNIS main mod and checked in the left pane.

ok thanks i didn't know that its really good to know i always thought that i had to keep it in admin mode 

 

 

and no i am pretty sure it was attached to fnis problem yes i installed fnis creatures seperately and yes its below main one i will take mo off admin mode now so thanks i hope this fixes it

 

((edit)) just ran it on normal  mode and still got the fnis creature pack error


Edited by randomnessincarnate, 04 January 2016 - 08:30 AM.

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#15 GrantSP

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Posted 04 January 2016 - 06:07 PM

If you can post your MO logs please so we can examine them. Also your modlist.txt will help determine which mods might be misplaced.





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