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Nehrim and Archive Invalidation


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#1 raycrios

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 08:26 AM

So, I've managed to finally get Nehrim running through the Mod Organizer. One of the problems that I've managed to solve in a non-standard way is to use Wrye Bash to generate the Archive Invalidation bsa, because the MO's built-in Archive Invalidation didn't work for me at all for some reason.


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#2 hishutup

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Posted 28 October 2015 - 12:21 PM

Since mo manages the bsas, you may need to drag the AI bsa to the top of the archives list.

#3 raycrios

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 06:21 AM

Since mo manages the bsas, you may need to drag the AI bsa to the top of the archives list.

You mean the AI bsa generated by the MO? It is at the top, but still archives not getting invalidated not sure why. The AI generated by the Wrye Bash is at the bottom and it works now.

 

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#4 DoubleYou

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 09:02 AM

Well, due to the nature of archive invalidation (AI), it is impossible that the Wrye Bash AI BSA is doing anything from that screenshot, and it is indeed the MO one that is working. AI requires the AI BSA to be at the top of the list.



#5 raycrios

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 10:43 AM

Well, due to the nature of archive invalidation (AI), it is impossible that the Wrye Bash AI BSA is doing anything from that screenshot, and it is indeed the MO one that is working. AI requires the AI BSA to be at the top of the list.

Then how do you explain that turning WryeBash's AI bsa makes it so AI doesn't work anymore? Yes, I am aware that first BSA in the list is supposed to do the invalidation but this is what I observe.


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#6 DoubleYou

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 11:01 AM

It probably has something to do with the awkward way you have installed Nehrim, since the vanilla BSAs do not appear to be located in their typical positions. As long as you have AI working, I suppose you'll be fine, but if you notice it "not" working sometime later, it may be worth looking into. My guess is that removing the Wrye Bash AI BSA may cause MO to completely rearrange the BSAs, since everything shown is obviously installed directly to the data folder, and that is what is causing AI to stop working.



#7 raycrios

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 11:52 AM

It probably has something to do with the awkward way you have installed Nehrim, since the vanilla BSAs do not appear to be located in their typical positions. As long as you have AI working, I suppose you'll be fine, but if you notice it "not" working sometime later, it may be worth looking into. My guess is that removing the Wrye Bash AI BSA may cause MO to completely rearrange the BSAs, since everything shown is obviously installed directly to the data folder, and that is what is causing AI to stop working.

No, it's not installed to the DATA folder... Not sure why is it so obvious to you. The only non standard stuff in my Oblivion DATA folder is the OBSE subfolder with plugins subfolder. Everything else are just usual folders under the mods folder of MO - MO mods in other words.

And yeah, MO seem to be really-REALLY buggy when Oblivion is under the Steam and MO have to use Script Extender hooking mode... For example, sometimes game is started with wrong Oblivion.ini - no the one from the MO profile. Sometimes if the mod was deselected in the left pane when game is launched mod is still there. Etc...


Edited by raycrios, 29 October 2015 - 12:14 PM.

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#8 DoubleYou

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 08:02 PM

If the game starts with the wrong INI, it is not hooked at all.

 

Took a closer look, and you're right. Been awhile since I looked at Oblivion. I'm just curious as to why the Oblivion BSAs are grouped with the Nehrim BSAs? Did you decided to move them to the Nehrim mod, or does Nehrim have replacement BSAs of them?

 

It sounds to me like the whole issue never was AI, but rather a hooking issue. Remember with Oblivion you need to launch Oblivion through Steam just like you would an unmodded game. Oblivion will be hooked by OBSE, which will then hook MO into it, and load your mods.



#9 raycrios

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 02:01 AM

If the game starts with the wrong INI, it is not hooked at all.

 

Took a closer look, and you're right. Been awhile since I looked at Oblivion. I'm just curious as to why the Oblivion BSAs are grouped with the Nehrim BSAs? Did you decided to move them to the Nehrim mod, or does Nehrim have replacement BSAs of them?

 

It sounds to me like the whole issue never was AI, but rather a hooking issue. Remember with Oblivion you need to launch Oblivion through Steam just like you would an unmodded game. Oblivion will be hooked by OBSE, which will then hook MO into it, and load your mods.

Nehrim when it's getting installed makes a copy of Oblivion files. So basically, I just copied everything from DATA folder of Nehrim as a mod for MO hence why Oblivion BSA's are displayed under the Nehrim mod. Removing them from the Nehrim mod folder was causing CTD right after pressing on New Game or trying to load existing game, even though, the same files exists under the original Oblivion\Data... So yeah... maybe it's also somehow related to strange AI invalidation problem that I had.

 

And sure thing Oblivion is launched through the Steam. OBSE with plugins also works so here I think everything works correctly.

 

MO + Steam Oblivion + OBSE hooking = pain in the a.. At least from my experience...


Edited by raycrios, 30 October 2015 - 02:04 AM.

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#10 GSDFan

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Posted 31 October 2015 - 07:32 AM

 

And yeah, MO seem to be really-REALLY buggy when Oblivion is under the Steam and MO have to use Script Extender hooking mode... For example, sometimes game is started with wrong Oblivion.ini - no the one from the MO profile. Sometimes if the mod was deselected in the left pane when game is launched mod is still there. Etc...

 

 

If the game starts with the wrong INI, it is not hooked at all.

 

 

 

If you take a look at this thread, Double Launcher when running through MO, you should note that when using the Script extender load mechanism in MO, you will use the ini files from the My Games folder when the game is launched. MO is at this point a plugin and until it loads I believe those are being used. I do not know if at any point the profile ini files are used. Only Tannin can answer this.



#11 raycrios

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Posted 31 October 2015 - 01:09 PM

If you take a look at this thread, Double Launcher when running through MO, you should note that when using the Script extender load mechanism in MO, you will use the ini files from the My Games folder when the game is launched. MO is at this point a plugin and until it loads I believe those are being used. I do not know if at any point the profile ini files are used. Only Tannin can answer this.


Oh, that explains. Thanks!
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