Trump

[TechAngel85]

(sorry for my English)

 

As a belgium guy, i was surprised two weeks ago in Vegas. i was there for a IT Security Convention (Intel security). The first day i discussed with a woman that manage a very good mexican restaurant on the strip.

 

i was surprised by these facts

 

she spent 10 years as an illegal worker in the U.S.

she was made US Citizen three years ago by the way of an Obama initiative

but she wanted to vote for TRUMP

 

for me,with my european mind, it was a little bit difficult to understand so i asked her very politely if she could explain me that case

 

her answer was very simple. i'll resume this like..

 

"As i am now a us Citizen, i feel that i must vote"

"i will never vote for a democrat women that accept to receive so much money from banks for so small speech"

"i want to see things changing. better a bad change than nothing"

"i don't trust in Clinton"

 

This resume well the situation. US mind looks sometime like alien for us. But i'm sure that it's the same in the other way.

 

Mandalay

Thanks for sharing your story!

 

I actually heard a lot of similar stories from Trump voters. Basically they don't trust Clinton. Especially after the email scandal. Trump isn't the best, but he mainly speaks his mind regardless whether what he says is good or bad. He also owned up to his mainly of his faults during the campaign such as the "locker room talk". Let's be honest, many guys talk like that amongst themselves. We can be pigs sometimes.

[TehKaoZ]

Couple thoughts

 

Clinton is far from an angel to be sure but I still don't know that a corrupt businessman is better than a corrupt politician for President (ergo one having no experience for the job). I guess we will find out.

 

Even if we ignore all the inflammatory comments that Trump makes on a daily basis I don't see him as being competent enough to do the job. To echo what others have said, I don't even think he thought he would win and now he's scrambling to figure out what the heck to do.

 

He's also a pathological lier (WAY more than Clinton is) so even if you agree with his policies; I feel like he won't actually implement many/if any of them, He was just performing for the voters.

 

His cabinet choices are already causing increased civil unrest

 

He barley addressed any of the hate crimes being committed in his name

 

I have yet to run across any of his supporters who actually think he's not above any sort of criticism. They completely alleviate him or his (future) administration from all sorts of personal responsibility and blame anything else they can (Media, Liberals, ect). I hope this is just the vocal minority but... 

 

Also been some concern about fake news outlets. Trump kept touting that mainstream news outlets were against him and statistics show that quite a few people shared completely bogus news articles.

You will notice that many of the "fake articles" that people shared are either Pro Trump, or Anti Hillary

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-fake-news-donald-trump-buzzfeed-chart-2016-11

[Tesla8209]

I'm seeing the West go through the same historical beats that led to the fall of my country long ago. The people are unaware of the lengths governments, media, and financial institutions can go to get what they want. Is the concept of a border wall now "racist" because it's a rejection of some utopian concept of open borders? From what I recall, the line that set the media on fire about Trump being "racist" near the start of the election cycle was him explaining that illegal immigrants that cross the border are composed of criminals with reason to avoid the proper naturalization process. Does attacking this group of criminals now constitute as an attack on an entire ethnicity? Take note on how this collective view on a people only comes into play when it's convenient for those who stand to gain from the status quo.

 

The argument to buffer Muslim immigration? A reasonable desire, albeit skirting the line of legality, for those who can think beyond the emotional gratification of welcoming someone from an exotic, foreign land into your home and observe long term cultural ramifications. Take Europe for instance. Their native populations' birthrates are on a decline. As a means of self-preservation, the government's solution has been to import migrants from Africa and the Middle East - who ironically are fleeing because of Western intervention in the regions in the first place - without any form of assimilation out of a mandatory respect for other cultures as dictated by law. The expectation is that they'll be a source of cheap labor and proponents of big government. While there is not much friction when native Europeans move between countries, many of the people of Africa and Middle East have cultures that are far removed from European standards. Any form of resistance to this change in Europe gets you slapped with a string of labels: xenophobe, racist, Islamaphobe, etc. In more recent cases, you can even get sent to prison for criticism of these policies. The basis of this argument is that rejecting a government policy is because of irrational fear and not because of a deduction of what happens when two different cultures collide based on historical precedent. In essence, those who fling these labels around haphazardly have the audacity of claiming they can read peoples' minds.

 

Over the past two years, the right has been experiencing a resurgence while the left, which is currently the establishment in a majority of the West, is only doubling down on their refusal to assess the reality of the situation. I've seen many once proud liberals break ranks and join the right or form their own movements knowing their political parties have taken on an authoritarian and pro-corporate stance. You saw this in the US with Sanders. People are beginning to realize they've been taking advantage of by way of emotional appeals and fear of ostracization. They have figuratively severed all lines of communication with the mainstream media and academics as they were the main proponents of such policies seeping into society and becoming mandates. The suppression of such incidents such as the Rotherham rape scandal because of law enforcement's fear of being called "racist" and Sweden's continual cultural decline from an outsider's point of view all have more sway on a person's judgment than off-color remarks ever could no matter how desperately the media tries to alter perception.

 

I said little about Trump because I strongly disbelieve that celebrity appeal was the main force behind his success. He's ran for presidency in the past after all but without his 2015-2016 platform. It's his seizure of the often ignored, nuanced issues facing society that propelled him to victory and all the usual suspects behind these problems coming out of the woodwork to attack him. His invigorated voter base, finally seeing their issues brought to the forefront, made up for the smaller voter turnout this cycle.

 

Trying to watch the video but Youtube doesn't want to load.

 

This article sums up what is happening IMO

 

-snip-

 

TL;DR White privilege & Xenophobia

You pass the failings of the Democrat Party onto the voters using the same circular argumentation that cost them the election in the first place.

 

The first term is pseudoscience nonsense that was coined for the purpose of dismantling establishments by appealing towards the basic, tribal instincts of the lower classes without enlightening them about what really ails them. The second term, along with almost every derogatory -ist, -ism, and -phobia, has been reduced to mean nothing in the eyes of many over the past five years.

 

You may not see it that way, but speak to someone who has rejected most mainstream sites because of their constant bombardment and blame of all the world's issues on a particular race regardless of the individuals' social standing, class, and nationality. What are the expectations of telling someone their skin color is reason for their achievements and that they should feel guilty, and as penance for this original sin, they should flagellate themselves at every opportunity and bend the knee to the self-proclaimed oppressed, moral group? Do you expect them to meekly take your word as truth because you somehow know them all better than they know themselves? It may work on those who have bought into the self-loathing that has been pushed by their educational institutions since childhood. Those who reject your claims are instead caught in an absurd Chinese fingertrap where the more they deny your claim, the more they are seen as "guilty."

Edited November 21, 2016 by Tesla8209

[Nozzer66]

You can't call the guy who appeared on cult classic show Fresh Prince a clown. That triggers me you racist! You clearly hate Will Smith because he's black! That does it!

https://gifsec.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2015/08/Donald-Trump-WWE.gif

 

Wouldn't Dwayne Johnson be Rebublican? I assume if you don't like Don, then you don't align Republican?

 

Hands you the award for the most non-sequiteurs in a single sentence :) 

 

 

I dont like anyone who's got a track record of being a tool, regardless of party affiliation. :)

 

[TehKaoZ]

@Tesla8209

 

The terms I used are in relation to an article I posted. You essentially pulled the terms I used from a TL;DR statement and used it to put words in my mouth about blanketed statements. I suggest you actually read the article.

Edited November 21, 2016 by TehKaoZ

[Gyro]

Thanks for sharing your story!

 

I actually heard a lot of similar stories from Trump voters. Basically they don't trust Clinton. Especially after the email scandal. Trump isn't the best, but he mainly speaks his mind regardless whether what he says is good or bad. He also owned up to his mainly of his faults during the campaign such as the "locker room talk". Let's be honest, many guys talk like that amongst themselves. We can be pigs sometimes.

 

There's a difference between locker room talk and saying how much you enjoy sexually assaulting someone.  Tell me, if I was famous and could do anything I wanted to-including grabbing your dick and kissing you against your will-and get away without repercussion, would you be quite so sanguine if I bragged about how I could do it to you, or to anyone like you?

 

He owned up to them with the kind of political non-apology of "I'm sorry that people were offended."  There's a contradiction there-particularly in terms of someone who is supposedly speaking his mind all the time.

 

He's got a long, long litany of other flaws (and I dispute your characterization of him as a brilliant businessman) and we'll be really lucky if he doesn't ruin the lives of a lot of Americans.  We're stuck with him now, though, so there's not a whole lot of use in talking about how much of a disaster his presidency may (or, God willing, may not) be. 

 

I did want to say that bragging about sexually assaulting people isn't okay, and ask you (and others) to consider that a lot of folks' reaction to it wasn't because it was vulgar, but because he was saying he could do what he wanted with a woman against her will with no repercussions.

[TechAngel85]

I did want to say that bragging about sexually assaulting people isn't okay, and ask you (and others) to consider that a lot of folks' reaction to it wasn't because it was vulgar, but because he was saying he could do what he wanted with a woman against her will with no repercussions.

Of course that's not okay and I never meant that it was. I was only addressing his banter. Not what he was bantering about.

[MonoAccipiter]

He hardly acknowledged his fault with the "locker room talk" (which is rather vulgar banter, encouraging viewpoint that are not fit for someone who intends to lead a country). Unless you mean constantly repeating the mantra of "I have great respect for women" and "Women know I have great respect for them", despite both things being proved blatantly false time and time again. I also saw him spend one minute and forty-five seconds of a two minute answer to the question "do you understand that what you were describing is sexual assault" by talking about ISIS. Talk about a cheap red herring! As I recall it, the only person saying "I made a mistake" in any of those debates was Hilary Clinton discussing her email scandal. Which, I know, wasn't all of what people considered her mistakes, but then again, when did Trump really address all of his mistakes? When did he release his tax returns? Isn't that a direct parallell to Hilary Clinton being derided for not releasing what she said in her speeches?

 

TehKaoZ and Gyro managed to summarize most of my other feeling around the subject, I just particularly reacted at that description. (I still have great respect for you, Tech, please don't take it as a signal of anything else than that  )

[TechAngel85]

Not at all. I personally think they're both idiots and I typically stay out of politics. Mainly just repeating what I've heard from others. The pigs parts was all mine though. ::