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Skyrim Nexus Downloader


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#46 Mator

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 12:25 PM

Nice to hear! I had thought about using Nexus's version when it rolls out, however my understanding is it will only be for Vortex, which we don't support. We'll look into other products eventually, and when they're available, because I know a lot of users would love such a thing. Even if there is just an automatic, "download and install" option, the rest of the Guide's details could be put into a "configuration" portion. However, doing so would likely require a separate Guide for users completely the Guide using a automation method; since at that point the mod tables wouldn't be necessary and a lot of information on the current/new Guide would be redundant.

It's also most likely not going to be able to handle mods from any source other than the nexus, so that's a real limiting factor.

The way the mod picker utility works is it literally "just works" with any mod picker mod list. So you get it for free by having the guide mod lists on mod picker. I have plans to integrate it with zMerge and zSmash in the future.
 

On the flip side of this, we've always believed that the entire modding process is part of gaining experience. With automation, users wouldn't be getting such experience, which greatly helps them down the road when issues arise. My only negative comment about automation that...users don't gain the experience they need to truly mod.

I recognize where this is coming from, but I don't think it's necessarily correct. I think that while some mod users are interested in gaining experience and understanding things, there are just as many (if not more) users who don't want to have that hassle because they simply do not have the time to invest. Hypothetically, automation can serve as a way for those people to "just play the game" when they don't have the time to invest in setting things up and learning how it works.


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#47 Razorsedge877

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 06:41 PM

   I fall under both categories. I have learned alot about modding and computers in general due to Skrim. I am now trying to understand conflict resolution for my fallout 4 game, but on the same note I have spent the last two or three months trying to install Lexy's LOTD guide between slow download times, working, family time, other games and hobbies and just dont have time to spend hours on end at my computer installing such a massive guide that is constantly evolving. Trust me I enjoy learning and am not complaining at all, but all the hours I spend trying to install these mods and guides I wonder why am I wasting so much of the "only one life I get, away". Options are a good thing to have.


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#48 TechAngel85

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Posted 20 April 2019 - 03:58 PM

I recognize where this is coming from, but I don't think it's necessarily correct. I think that while some mod users are interested in gaining experience and understanding things, there are just as many (if not more) users who don't want to have that hassle because they simply do not have the time to invest. Hypothetically, automation can serve as a way for those people to "just play the game" when they don't have the time to invest in setting things up and learning how it works.

I understand this side of it too. Many users have asked for a torrent that is already set up because this. Others have offered us money to remote in and do it for them. So I get that there are users out there who simply don't have the time. It's the users who want such results from modding without putting in the effort that I was focusing more towards.

I wouldn't be surprised if MO2 eventually supports Nexus's solution, once it's fully up and running.

 

   I fall under both categories. I have learned alot about modding and computers in general due to Skrim. I am now trying to understand conflict resolution for my fallout 4 game, but on the same note I have spent the last two or three months trying to install Lexy's LOTD guide between slow download times, working, family time, other games and hobbies and just dont have time to spend hours on end at my computer installing such a massive guide that is constantly evolving. Trust me I enjoy learning and am not complaining at all, but all the hours I spend trying to install these mods and guides I wonder why am I wasting so much of the "only one life I get, away". Options are a good thing to have.

Yeah, that guide is not really for a new user. I would say it's geared more towards intermediate to advanced users. A new user could certainly learn a lot from completing Lexy's massive, but really good guide; however, such users are going to have a very large learning curve when starting off with such a guide. I've completed it once in the past and I think it took me a few hours of free time over a few days to finish it. The downloading and installing of mods is typically what takes the longest on any guide used. The STEP guide isn't even geared towards a completely new user, as we expect users to be partly familiar with the tools used.



#49 Shadriss

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Posted 22 April 2019 - 12:00 PM

Yeah, that guide is not really for a new user. I would say it's geared more towards intermediate to advanced users. A new user could certainly learn a lot from completing Lexy's massive, but really good guide; however, such users are going to have a very large learning curve when starting off with such a guide. I've completed it once in the past and I think it took me a few hours of free time over a few days to finish it. The downloading and installing of mods is typically what takes the longest on any guide used. The STEP guide isn't even geared towards a completely new user, as we expect users to be partly familiar with the tools used.

WRT To Lexy's Guide, the average time I'm seeing from new installers who know what they are about is roughly three days to a week, depending on free time. Taking much longer than that gets problematic because of the weekly guide updates there. Add in that many of the mods have special installation instructions and the like, and it's not one that would be easily adapted to any kind of automation process. These days, Lexy and Co refer the trully new modders to guides like TUCOS, which at least gives them some comfort with the tools.


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#50 Mator

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 11:01 AM

it's not one that would be easily adapted to any kind of automation process.

I took a peek and I think there's a few things that are happening in the guide which you might be talking about-
 

  • Editing of certain configuration files
  • Dummy ESP deletion and BSA extraction
  • Replacement of certain mod files with custom patched versions
  • Combining of certain mods into the same mod installation folder
  • Converting of certain plugins to ESL
  • Conversion of plugins to form version 44
  • Cleaning of certain plugin files
  • Nif Optimization
  • Some moving around of files in certain situations
  • Merging of plugins

 

None of this is impossible to automate, and much of it can already be automated.  Certain things can just be done by the user, the automation doesn't have to do 100%.  I think the only things you'd really want to make sure the automation got right is combining of mods into the same mod installation folder, moving files around, and replacement of certain mod files with custom patched versions.  All of this is completely doable.  Everything here could be automated, but some bits require more development to automate than others.  None of this has to be automated, as it could all be done as secondary steps by the user after the mod files have been downloaded and installed.


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#51 Shadriss

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 12:38 PM

You're not wrong on the items I was thinking of. But I was mostly referring to the weekly updates, which would require not just the current update process she goes through, but also the automation processing. She's got enough of a problem with her writing (try reading her posts sometimes - it's a new form of English we all have to learn to read...), and adding in the automation updates every week might not be something she'd want to do, though some of her Dev Team might be willing to do so. 

 

Heaven knows *I* would like the automation, if only for doing the weekly updates.

 

The other item would be all the Merges that are part of the Guide as well, and since you (literally) wrote the book on merging, I imagine you could work that into the process as well somehow.


Edited by Shadriss, 23 April 2019 - 12:39 PM.

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#52 Mator

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 12:51 PM

Sure, I understand.  I'm aware of how making regular updates to both a written guide and an automated one would be challenging.  I have some ideas about how I can reduce that work, so we'll see how things go.  Needless to say, I want to make this possible, so collaborating with Lexy and and the rest of her dev team would be something I'm interested in doing.


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#53 Shadriss

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 01:16 PM

:grin: Not like you don't know where they're at... not that I see you chat much over there on the 'cord. 


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#54 Mator

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 07:08 PM

:grin: Not like you don't know where they're at... not that I see you chat much over there on the 'cord. 

I'm there, but I primarily pay attention to the channels about my tools.  I'm very busy, as you may know.  ;)


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#55 Shadriss

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Posted 23 April 2019 - 09:57 PM

Who knew? As a note, I saw the mention on Discord, but I'm not there often myself at the moment. Feel free to start up a PM discussion with me if you want to continue the convo.


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