Very strange bug (stutter every one second)

[TioDrakul]

Hello, I've had this weird bug for some time now and I decided to ask for help.

 

Firstly, I would like to point out that my INI configuration is correct and working, that I do not have or should have problems with VRAM (RTX 2080Ti 11GB) and as far as I know I ran dyndoload installation without errors.

 

The error in question is a strange stutter that repeats approximately once per second, as if once per second the game would stop to do something and then continue. I have found that the problem is caused by Dyndolod, to be exact being something related to the files in the Data/Meshes/Terrain/WorldName¹ folder, if experimentally I delete the directory "WorldName" the stutter stops happening. As example, I have the once per second stutter in Solstheim and it stops if I delete the folder "DLC2SolstheimWorld". It should also be noted that the stutter happens even though I stand still in one place without moving.

 

Also, if I look into the ENB status (profiler), I noticed that for some reason dyndolod causes ENB to keep loading textures at a constant rate, the "textures of valid data size" parameter keeps incrementing and then, once per second, the ENB unloads something and I think this is the cause of the stutter. And the most interesting thing is that it doesn't happen in Tamriel's worldspace, only in DLCs or mods worldspaces.

 

In short, something in the "terrain" files generated by dyndolod is causing this problem and I would like to know if it was something that I would have forgotten to configure in dyndolod or if it was a bug there.

 

 

¹ The name of the worldspace: For example "Tamriel", "DLC2SolstheimWorld", etc

[sheson]

If you believe there is an issue with a texture, you should check the object LOD atlases in Textures\DynDOLOD\LOD\*.dd and the tree LOD atlas in textures\terrain\tamriel\trees\tamrieltreelod.dds

 

Maybe ENB does not like it when they 8k (Though we should have heard by now, unless it is a new thing). You could manually resize them.

[TioDrakul]

If you believe there is an issue with a texture, you should check the object LOD atlases in Textures\DynDOLOD\LOD\*.dd and the tree LOD atlas in textures\terrain\tamriel\trees\tamrieltreelod.dds

 

Maybe ENB does not like it when they 8k (Though we should have heard by now, unless it is a new thing). You could manually resize them.

 

Note that I actually found two possible causes for the problem, where the first would be something going wrong inside the meshes/terrain files and the second might be related to the textures these meshes try to load. At the moment I am at work but when I return home I will test your suggestion.

[TioDrakul]

Okay, back at home. I tried the following tactics to see what would break first or eliminate the stutter:

 

P.S: Before each test I backed up the files to be deleted, made the test and then restored them before moving on to the next test.

 

 

1) Delete the terrain texture directory associated with the worldspace (in this test was DLC2SolstheimWorld): No changes;

 

2) Delete only the trees (textures and meshes, same worldspace): No changes;

 

3) Delete the textures from the directory "Textures\DynDOLOD\LOD\" as suggested: No changes;

 

4) Delete the directory "Meshes\Terrain\DLC2SolstheimWorld": Worked, no stutter anymore;

 

 

It looks like there is something broken in this folder (several .bto files with varying sizes), Maybe I forgot some little known configuration when generating them with Dyndolod? Or is it some obscure bug? Any tips on what I could do to get around this problem would be helpful

 

[sheson]

You should try to narrow it down to see if it is caused by a single file.

[TioDrakul]

You should try to narrow it down to see if it is caused by a single file.

I was thinking about this but I suspect the cause of the problem is not a specific .bto file, considering that the problem happens in all other Worldspaces except "Tamriel". I suspect it's some game object where the conversion to .bto didn't work out, and I'd like to know from you what situations could cause this for me to try to fix.

 

And Looking more closely at ENB's behavior, I noticed that it have a pattern in what is happening. The loaded texture counter continues to increase steadily (one at a time), while approximately once per second the number of drawcalls suddenly increases and then ENB reports that it has unloaded a set of textures, then repeats the entire process in next second. I'm not sure if I'm correct about this but I would guess the game engine is trying to load a dyndolod-generated object, the load fails and then a second later it tries again

[sheson]

It doesn't matter if the issue is in a single BTO or in a dozen. We just need to have one BTO that causes the problem so we can actually look at it.

 

You might want to check for similar issues with ENB regardless of LOD. It sounds a bit like it is running out of memory and needs to make room regardless of the 11GB VRAM. Come to think of it, I don't even know what game version you are using.

 

There is no such thing as a "DynDOLOD generated object". Object LOD BTOs is build by LODGen.exe from combining models found in the load order. DynDOLOD does nothing to any models in this process. It just creates a list of those objects for LODGen.exe.

 

In your troubleshooting you should consider one simple fact: Nobody else has reported any such problem in several years. So this might be something new in ENB or another mod.

Edited August 20, 2019 by sheson

[TioDrakul]

It doesn't matter if the issue is in a single BTO or in a dozen. We just need to have one BTO that causes the problem so we can actually look at it.

 

You might want to check for similar issues with ENB regardless of LOD. It sounds a bit like it is running out of memory and needs to make room regardless of the 11GB VRAM. Come to think of it, I don't even know what game version you are using.

 

There is no such thing as a "DynDOLOD generated object". Object LOD BTOs is build by LODGen.exe from combining models found in the load order. DynDOLOD does nothing to any models in this process. It just creates a list of those objects for LODGen.exe.

 

In your troubleshooting you should consider one simple fact: Nobody else has reported any such problem in several years. So this might be something new in ENB or another mod.

 

About the BTO, I understand what you mean.. What I want to add is that it happens in all the other worldspaces generated by DLCs or mods so I find it unlikely that the cause of the problem is just a specific bto (if that were the case then I would have the problem only into the worldspace that i used in previous tests). But I will try to test anyway to see if the cause would be any or all of them.

 

About the DynDOLOD generated object I know, I know. The important thing is that you understand what I meant, I know that in practice BTOs are generated by LodGen. I was hoping that you would know some configuration of the same that I may have forgotten and that if used could solve the problem.

 

About the ENB, their behavior is the symptom that something is wrong, not the cause (because if I remove all BTOs then the "stutter every second" stops happening). I was hoping that describing what he is doing may help to understand what problem the BTOs would be causing.

 

Finally, about the version of the game I'll see when I'm at home, and I believe I've already tested lack of texture memory by removing the BTOs while keeping the texture files. By now I'm pretty sure the problem is in the BTOs, I just can't imagine what that problem would be.

[sheson]

I would not make any assumptions about BTO, ENB or anything else without any testing.

 

Do you use full model trees for LOD?

 

The vanilla BTO use a different object LOD texture. So removing BTO also means the generated object LOD texture(s) are not used.

[TioDrakul]

I would not make any assumptions about BTO, ENB or anything else without any testing.

 

Do you use full model trees for LOD?

 

The vanilla BTO use a different object LOD texture. So removing BTO also means the generated object LOD texture(s) are not used.

 

And how do I find out if I'm using full tree models like you mentioned? And since you mentioned trees I went to take one more look at their textures and I noticed something that I can't tell if it's correct: Using GIMP I can see the textures of trees like the ones on "textures\terrain\DLC2SolstheimWorld\Trees" (shows on GIMP as many tree pictures), but the ones from "textures\terrain\LODGen\Dragonborn.esm" like the "TreePineForestAsh01_00017F72.dds" are just white rectangles with some layers (also blanks) on GIMP. This is normal or maybe is the cause of my problem?

 

EDIT: Dumb me, just outdated DDS GIMP plugin. The DDS files are fine, but I still need to know how to find out if I am using full tree models

Edited August 20, 2019 by TioDrakul

[TioDrakul]

Well, more testing. As I raised earlier, if I remove the BTOs from the worldspace under test (DLC2SolstheimWorld, Dragonborn DLC) the "once-per-second" stutter stops happening. I am guessing that there maybe some of then are broken, so I noticed that they have a already made "package" of LODs on Nexus (the DynDOLOD static LOD sample download for Dragonborn DLC). So after removing the current BTOs and their texture files I then tried installing this sample package to see what would happen using BTOs and textures that in theory have no errors.

 

The result is that visually the result is more or less like the expected using the locally generated BTOs by me, but the stutter also happens with the sample package.

 

So now I am lost on what could be the cause of the problem. After all, the game's INI settings and ENB setting should be correct since by simply removing the BTOs the stutter disappears, if i had a problem with the settings then the stutter would happen even with the removed btos. And remembering again that the same doesn't happen in Worldspace Tamriel, ie in Tamriel I can use BTOs and the game don't stutter once every second.

[sheson]

If you don't know if you are using full models for 3D tree LOD, then you most most likely don't. 3D tree LOD requires changing settings in the DynDOLOD ini.

 

>After all, the game's INI settings and ENB setting should be correct since by simply removing the BTOs the stutter disappears

 

To test if INI settings are fine, use default INIs. To test if ENB settings are fine, disable ENB.

 

After that it seems to make sense to make a new profile in MO, only with vanilla, unofficial patch, SkyUI and the show case - or generate with medium settings if you like - and then slowly enabling mods or change INI settings, ENB to see when the issue actually starts happening.

[TioDrakul]

Strange. I tried to generate LODs using the medium settings and the generator can't get past the point where it would create the textures for the Tamriel Atlas. While if I use the high settings the generator runs smoothly until the end.

[TioDrakul]

I found the source of the problem. I had the idea to go eliminating BTOs by file size, and so I found out that if I remove all BTOs smaller than 2kb the stutter stops. I am attaching them to this comment so you can take a look at what would be wrong with them since I have no way of identifying what the problem is inside them.

temp.7z

[sheson]

Those are just empty files because there are no objects with LOD in those areas. They exist so older LOD files are replaced and do not show outdated or unnecessary hidden LOD. It's a mystery what else is in your load order that you are the only one who seems to have issue with them in 5 years.

 

I attached an alternative version of those files. Please test if the problem happens with them.

test.7z

Edited August 23, 2019 by sheson

[TioDrakul]

Those are just empty files because there are no objects with LOD in those areas. They exist so older LOD files are replaced and do not show outdated or unnecessary hidden LOD. It's a mystery what else is in your load order that you are the only one who seems to have issue with them in 5 years.

 

I attached an alternative version of those files. Please test if the problem happens with them.

Hum... Makes sense. I had imagined that they could be simply empty files, I just can't imagine why their existence would make my game have the stutter I described. As for why no one has reported this before, maybe I'm just the first one who paid attention to this behavior? I'm at work now, but I'll test with the files you provided when I'm home.