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Interactive Clutter (by fireundubh)

mod dawnguard hearthfire dragonborn

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#61 TechAngel85

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 09:26 AM

Contacted Brumbek with a link to my post above and an invitation to join the forums.



#62 DoubleYou

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 09:53 AM

Brumbek is already a member. He merely hasn't been active here since almost a year now.



#63 Brumbek

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 01:16 PM

On the second part, you know as well as anyone here that you can be pointing your cursor right at an object, and still get the interaction for another one that, in Skyrim's mind, is between you and the intended object. That said, I'll acknowledge that point because...

Well, just to clarify, this often happens because of how the collision is set up on models. Bethesda often made the colliision model not the same size as the visual model. This causes no end of trouble, such as the cursor picking up objects you aren't looking at.

 

There are three cart meshes in the game. Two are static. One was a moveable static and was converted to a miscellaneous item. Normal statics don't have physics, so when I converted them, I could pick them up but dropping them caused them to freeze in midair. They also couldn't be grabbed. And they caused carts that have statics placed in them to go crazy. I left them as statics.

As you probably know, you could add collision to fix this issue if you wanted. If the carts that hovered are the exact same size as the other carts, you could perhaps get away with copying the collision from the other cart mesh. Otherwise, more complex methods using NifUtils would be needed to merge/recreate the collision. And that is not fun, let me tell you.

 

Those are the Form IDs of the REFR records. Pie FoodPie "Apple Pie" [ALCH:00064B43] ClutterIngredientsPie01.nif Plate GlazedPlate01 "Plate" [MISC:000B9BD0] ClutterGlazedPlate01.nif Honey Nut Treat nuttybread01.nif   Also, SMIM doesn't touch those meshes. Ask Brumbek to take a look at them.

Who dares mention Brumbek!? Oh, I mean, hello. Interesting mod, thanks for your efforts. I looked over all three meshes. The Pie looks fine. The Plate's collision is wacky, being comprised of two ugly boxes that don't even fit correctly. Oh Bethesda, using a square collision on a round plate! Honey Nut collision is too small but shouldn't cause issues except perhaps falling an inch or two upon cell load.

 

So the Glazed Plate collision should be fixed. By fixed I mean recreated using NifUtils. Will this fix the shaking plate thing? No clue really. It is possible some plates are placed too close to the edge of the table and hence the player bumps into one of the square edges, but this shouldn't cause all that shaking. But full disclosure: I don't really understand the collision/physics of Skyrim...but who does?


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#64 fireundubh

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 05:40 PM

So... does this mean you're going to fix the collision meshes on the objects that rest on tables and stuff?  ::D:  But, yeah, I could add collisions to the remaining hand cart statics; they usually have a static "inside" them though. For example, in front of the Dushnikh Yal main building, there's a hand cart with a pile of wood on top of the interior of the cart. If you pick up the cart, the pile of wood remains floating in the air. If I converted the pile of wood to a miscellaneous item and added collision, then Dynamic Things couldn't convert that pile of wood into a container. Which would be okay if I made a breakdown recipe for converting that pile of wood into firewood, but then more work for me... By the way, everyone, here's a list of the meshes that are used in Interactive Clutter: https://docs.google....gP4Yk0w/pubhtml Of the 92 meshes, 20 are SMIM'd.

Edited by fireundubh, 15 August 2014 - 05:53 PM.

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#65 Brumbek

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 07:46 PM

So... does this mean you're going to fix the collision meshes on the objects that rest on tables and stuff?  ::D:  But, yeah, I could add collisions to the remaining hand cart statics; they usually have a static "inside" them though. By the way, everyone, here's a list of the meshes that are used in Interactive Clutter: https://docs.google....gP4Yk0w/pubhtml Of the 92 meshes, 20 are SMIM'd.

...when I work up the desire to torture myself I will attempt to review the 92 meshes and see which ones need updated collision. I'm betting many of them do since Bethesda created such rubbish collision for many clutter items.

 

I should mention...updating the collision won't necessarily fix weird physics issues. For instance, many clutter objects are placed just barely on top of each other or inside each other. Hence, the engine has to resolve this issue upon cell load, usually causing the objects to slightly move up or down and hover briefly. So just saying...if an item has proper collision it still can wreak...havok...if it isn't placed precisely.

 

About that incompatibility with Dynamic Things, yeah...understood. Obviously, you'll have a mod conflict, although it wouldn't be serious I wouldn't think since either mod would overwrite the other...but users might not understand and freak out.

 

Anyway...I'll post back once I have time to update some collision. NifUtils makes it possible...but it still is very unfun and prone to errors for unknown reasons.


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#66 fireundubh

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 08:03 PM

...when I work up the desire to torture myself I will attempt to review the 92 meshes and see which ones need updated collision. I'm betting many of them do since Bethesda created such rubbish collision for many clutter items.

It's only 72 for you!  :;):   

Anyway...I'll post back once I have time to update some collision. NifUtils makes it possible...but it still is very unfun and prone to errors for unknown reasons.

Can you actually fix collisions with only NifUtils? I thought you had to import the NIF to Maya, 3ds max, or Blender and then export back to NIF?


Edited by fireundubh, 15 August 2014 - 08:03 PM.

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