CTD while exploring Bilegulch Mine

[whitewolf87]

Hey there. Thanks in advance, because I got a feeling this is one of those really weird ones.

I used STEP to the letter (omitting a few of the fluffy mods that made me go "meh"), have played my character (Menji) a lot, had a few random CTD's, one or two freezes, but nothing my limited computer skills couldn't really dismiss and move on with my life with.

Menji is level 40, he's just joined the DB, having completed the main quest, and just completed the first series of contracts given him by Nazir. He was one foot (love that Wayfarer), trying to get to Markarth for the contract "Mourning Never Comes". I passed an old watchtower (can't remember the name), cleaned out Glenmoril Coven, then I decided to stop by bilegulch mine. Kill the bandits (no problem), advances into the mine, activated a candlelight spell and also shouted for Dragon Aspect to defeat the bandit leader (not too hard), then proceeded to mine all the ore and leave to be on my way.

As I open the door, the autosave triggers CTD. I shrug it off, open the old Autosave from when I entered the mine (the new one didn't have time to be created before the CTD), and then I attempt to quicksave, and the quicksave CTD's. In fact, if I don't immediately save within about 25 seconds after loading, anything prompting a save of any kind (including any kind of manual saving), causes a CTD. It's extremely frustrating, and I don't know what prompted it. An earlier save file from when the first set of Nazir contracts were still open (but after I killed Narfi the beggar) works fines, saves perfectly well with all methods, though. I can go back to that one with no great loss, but I'm worried about exactly what prompted this specifically, because I don't want it to happen to me when I'm doing something important as opposed to dungeon-diving, because it's fairly game breaking, frustrating, and could force me into another annoying setback.

Things I've tried.

1. Any conceivable combination of saving before the ore is mined, after the ore is mined, holding the bandit leaders armor (it was worth a lot) in inventory, dropping his armor, dropping the loot items I found in the chest, dispelling candlelight and dragon aspect (by waiting immediately after a load which I can still do, but remember...if I try to save again right after that...CTD).
2. Running to the door once the game loads, getting through it and saving there (to test an exterior environment) (same problem)
3. Loading the save created in that 20 second window through getting to the exterior of the mine, fast traveling to another location, and saving there (in case this is totally a Bilegulch problem)
4. The "giving Sheson your firstborn" dll fix that was posted on nexus around this time last year (no joy at all). https://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/1340369-skyrim-memory-patch-fixing-ils-ugrids-ctd-freezes-for-real/
5. The "kill yourself in another save then open the glitchy save, then kill yourself" method.
6. Screaming.
7. Having a cup of tea.
8. Reloading a backup save. (either nonexistent or similarly glitched)
9. Deactivating Unknown Enchants (thought that might be the culprit because of the whole "recovering" thing.
10. Ran LOOT, recreated Bashed, all no joy.

 

God knows what I've managed to do in the three months or so that I've been playing this STEPified, between applying small fixes to minor problems myself. I honestly can't remember if I've done any INI tweaks that don't have anything to do with STEP (aside from Sheson up there), and I know I've downloaded a couple of other mods that I found awesome (like the Breezehome one), but I'll tell you anything I can.

Any help would be appreciated. Any at all. I'm no expert, barely even know what I'm doing half the time, but I'll do my absolute best.

Load Order...
 

Skyrim.esm
Update.esm
Unofficial Skyrim Patch.esp
Dawnguard.esm
Unofficial Dawnguard Patch.esp
HearthFires.esm
Unofficial Hearthfire Patch.esp
Dragonborn.esm
Unofficial Dragonborn Patch.esp
Falskaar.esm
Wyrmstooth.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel.esm
moonpath.esm
HighResTexturePack01.esp
HighResTexturePack02.esp
HighResTexturePack03.esp
Unofficial High Resolution Patch.esp
Cutting Room Floor.esp
Auto Unequip Ammo.esp
Appropriately Attired Jarls Redux.esp
Beards.esp
Chesko_LoreBasedLoadingScreens.esp
BetterQuestObjectives-Hearthfire.esp
ShootingStars.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel-Nights-Level-5.esp
Dual Wield Parrying_SKSE.esp
DeadlyDragons.esp
DeadlyMonsters.esp
Hothtrooper44_Armor_Ecksstra.esp
mintylightningmod.esp
Footprints.esp
GQJ_DG_vampireamuletfix.esp
Guard Dialogue Overhaul.esp
BWS.esp
Convenient Horses.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Major City Interiors.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel-Dungeons-Hardcore.esp
Lock Overhaul.esp
83Willows_101BUGS_V4_LowRes.esp
RaceMenuPlugin.esp
Weapons & Armor Fixes_Remade.esp
ADS.esp
RaceMenu.esp
Rainbows.esp
SMDropLitTorch.esp
SMIM-FarmhouseFlickeringFix.esp
Elemental Staves.esp
Footprints - Ash.esp
SkyRe_Main.esp
AOS.esp
IHSS.esp
DeadlySpellImpacts.esp
Animated Weapon Enchants.esp
Weapons & Armor_TrueOrcish&DaedricWeapons.esp
Clothing & Clutter Fixes.esp
Complete Crafting Overhaul_Remade.esp
SkyrimCoinReplacerRedux.esp
Breezehome_Fully_Upgradable.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Major City Exteriors.esp
RLO - Major City Exteriors - No Guard Torches.esp
ExplosiveBoltsVisualized.esp
SkyFalls + SkyMills.esp
Bring Out Your Dead.esp
BetterQuestObjectives.esp
Thieves Guild Requirements.esp
aMidianBorn_ContentAddon.esp
BetterQuestObjectives-Dawnguard.esp
Book Covers Skyrim.esp
Dead Body Collision.esp
Immersive Weapons.esp
SDO Full-LOD - The Morthal Swamp Light.esp
Hothtrooper44_ArmorCompilation.esp
BirdsHFclean.esp
Point The Way.esp
HearthfireChimneys.esp
RealisticWaterTwo.esp
RealisticNeedsandDiseases.esp
RealisticWaterTwo - Legendary.esp
RND_Dawnguard-Patch.esp
RND_Dragonborn-Patch.esp
SkyRe_EnemyScaling.esp
SkyRe_Survivalism.esp
SkyUI.esp
TradeBarter.esp
dD - Enhanced Blood Main.esp
Soul Gems Differ.esp
TheChoiceIsYours.esp
SDO Full-LOD - Waterfall Effects.esp
Run For Your Lives.esp
Traps Make Noise.esp
fFastTravelSpeedMult_4.esp
WetandCold.esp
WetandCold - Ashes.esp
moonpath_questdata.esp
SkyrimImprovedPuddles-DG-HF-DB.esp
SDO Full-LOD - Whiterun Trundra Creeks.esp
SMIM-ShackRoofFixes.esp
SkyRe_StandingStones.esp
Chesko_Frostfall.esp
RND_HearthFires-Patch.esp
RND_AnimalLoot.esp
SkyRe_Races.esp
SkyRe_EnemyAI.esp
Skyrim Flora Overhaul.esp
PilgrimsDelight.esp
The Paarthurnax Dilemma.esp
STEP Extended Patch.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Dungeons.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel-Interiors-Cold.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Brighter Dungeons.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Dawnguard Interiors.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Weathers.esp
Realistic Lighting Overhaul - Weathers - Brighter Nights.esp
RLO - Adaptive Interiors Vanilla Weathers Patch.esp
BlockSparkles.esp
dD-Dragonborn-Dawnguard-EBT Patch.esp
SMIM-FurnitureChestSnowFix.esp
Radiant and Unique Potions and Poisons v2.0 non glow.esp
Gildergreen Regrown.esp
Improved Combat Sounds v2.2.esp
NonEssentialChildren.esp
Paralysis.esp
SMIM-DungeonsCliffsIceSkirts.esp
SMIM-ShackRoofFixesDragonborn.esp
SMIM-DragonbornTernFix.esp
SDO Full-LOD - Giant Campfires.esp
SkyRe_Combat.esp
TheChoiceIsYours_Dawnguard.esp
Chesko_Step418_SN.esp
aMidianborn_Skyforge_Weapons.esp
When Vampires Attack.esp
iHUD.esp
imp_helm_legend.esp
Improved Closefaced Helmets_Legendary.esp
ReProccer.esp
Bashed Patch, 0.esp
NoxUE2.00.esp

System Specs

OS: Windows 8.1 64 bit
RAM: 16 GB DDR4
CPU: Intel Core i7-5820K @ 3.30 GHz
SOUND: Realtek High Definition Audio
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780
RES: 1920 x 1080 32 bit
HD: SSHD 2 TB (768.9 GB or so free)
MB: ASUS x99-S

I have no idea why my spoiler tags aren't working. I'm sorry.

Edited January 3, 2015 by phazer11

[hishutup]

try this, deactivate FNIS and the files that were generated.

See if it will crash?

[whitewolf87]

Yep. CTD deactivating FNIS and it's output and also, just on a whim, Convenient Horses. Tried deactivating FNIS by itself first, then that plus CH, same result both times.
 

It's 3 AM in England, so I'm hitting the hay. I'll check back tomorrow. Thanks for all the help, guys.

Edited January 6, 2015 by whitewolf87

[Nozzer66]

I think it's time to start doing the old deactivate everything and start adding mods in small chunks till you find the issue...

[whitewolf87]

 

I think it's time to start doing the old deactivate everything and start adding mods in small chunks till you find the issue...

I already tried that. Convenient horses popped up as a problem mod, but after some more testing safesave2 was still generating CTD's, so the slow crawl didn't really work. I'm tempted to another one though anyway.

 

 

After all of the deactivations you have been redoing your bashed patch and such right? Also as a desperation option try backing up your save and running something like save game script scalpel.

Yeah, been rebuilding bashed and everything.

 

But with save game script scalpel I have a new problem...

 

I can't enable papyrus logging for some reason. I've added the lines to INI, but it just won't generate the logs. I've made sure the lines are in both the ini in the My Games/Skyrim folder, and that it's edited through MO.

 

EDIT: Scratch that. I fixed that problem. Forget to set a 0 to 1. I'll play with the save scalpel after I get back from errands today. Post the results when I get back.

Edited January 6, 2015 by whitewolf87

[whitewolf87]

Alright, I've got good news. But bear with me while I try to explain what happened because I only know about half of what I'm doing, I barely understand what just happened.

I just didn't think it was any of the mods, at least not from their very existence or being active. I felt that if it was, I would have had more problems earlier on, and the game was running fine until very recently (around level 38/39 was when I first started experiencing CTDs at *all*). So before I did another slow crawl, I decided to try the save scalpel reccomended by phazer11. My logic was that my Menji file was pretty much screwed, so the worst that could happen is that something I do would totally nuke it and at least make the failure to fix it final. At best, I figured it woudn't change anything.

So, I loaded it up and loaded safesave2 (DB Sanctuary), and tried the following procedure/test (an expanded version of the test I've been running over and over for the last couple of days, adding save scalpel functionality.

 

 

1. Load the save in scalpel.

2. In scalpel, remove unattached instances.

3. Load the edited save scalpel created in skyrim.

4. Immediatlely save a new game from there for further use in scalpel (during the intial window where saving still works, before wait/sleep)

5. Wait/sleep 24 hours (either one produces whatever dynamic triggers the CTD), then attempt to save.
6. Open the save I created in step 4 in scalpel.

7. Use scalpel to terminate active threads.

8. Repeat test in step 5.

 

 

On both safesave2 (DB Sanctuary safesave), and safesave3 (the one later created in Markarth trying to trailblaze through the problem), I was succesfully able to save after completing the 24 hour test wait period using all methods.

I didn't want to get too excited, but I felt I was onto something, so to be sure, I made sure the the original and still-corrupted safesave3 (Markarth) was still present (before it was modified and resaved as a new file by scalpel), and...

1. I deleted all the edited saves that scalpel created and the new cleaned saves that I created after opening the preceeding, just to be sure I was starting fresh.

2. I opened MO, made sure all the .esps that were active when the original problem was noticed in Bilegulch Mine were active now (allowing for the adjustments and redanancy that hishutup suggested in post #8 of this thread).

3. I ran Loot and let it sort.

4. The loot report indicated a good number of dirty edits (almost certainly created with all the activating, deactivating, testing, etcetera), so I cleaned them with TES5Edit (specifically they were all the Bethesda DLC plugins [Dawnguard, Heartfire, Dragonborn)

5. I ran loot one more time, checked the report, appllied the load order suggested (again, just to be safe).

6. I ran FNIS according to STEP directions.

7. I recreated the Bashed patch.

8. After having done all that boring good stuff, I reloaded the corrupt save, and made sure it was still causing a CTD after the 24 hour sleep/wait/save test (it was).

9. I used scalpel following the procedures described in the first spoiler box up there, 

10. After I had the corrupted save file cleaned, I loaded the working save created by scalpel, saved it again with my own filename, made sure the result file was uncorrupted (tested again with the 24 hour sleep/wait/save test).

11. I exited, reloaded that same file, and did a full clean save as outlined in the STEP troubleshooting guide.
12. I tested it again

 

 

It's been a long couple of days, but I think I got it fixed. I wouldn't have been able to do it without you guys' help. I really appreciate it and thank you, super special thanks to hishutup and phazer11. Seriously, thank you all so much.

Hopefully this'll help somebody else who had the same problem.

 

I'll keep this thread open (with mods blessing of course) just in case anything else pops up, but it does look like I can continue. I will still follow the saving indoors and no autosave rules that my friend suggested, because I still feel this is a potentially delicate save, but I think that I'm confident enough to start playing and enjoying myself.

 

EDIT I just realized the dirty DLC plugins were created mostly or totally by the verifying cache integrity that I did with Nozzer66's help. Sorry about that, I forgot you said that would happen.

Edited January 6, 2015 by whitewolf87

[whitewolf87]

UPDATE

 

Nevermind. Spoke too soon.

 

Still screwed.

 

I'm done.

Edited January 7, 2015 by whitewolf87

[Nozzer66]

:( Really sorry to hear that.

 

Not sure what else can be tried.

 

Hopefully everything comes good on any new playthrough.

Edited January 7, 2015 by Nozzer66

[whitewolf87]

I would like to apologize for my very rude troll of a brother-in-law who knew what was going on, and decided that it'd be a fun joke to come in and leave that last message on this thread and remove the best answer point for phazer11.

 

The game is STILL fine for now. I'm STILL tentatively enjoying myself, and as far as I know what I did up there is STILL a valid fix for this particular game. Nothing is going wrong yet, I will update this thread in a few days to give a report on how things are going.

 

And again, I AM SORRY, and there is NO EXCUSE FOR MY BROTHER IN LAW!

Have a good evening everyone. Apologies for the confusion.

[phazer11]

No problem. Let us know if you have anymore issues.

[whitewolf87]

UPDATE

 

Playing for a few days now, I still give it the all-clear. Been progressing through the DB questline with no major issues, of course continuing to do the 24 hours sleep/wait save test to be sure. Never failed that test once. All good there.

I did have a couple of times where I CTD'd while experimenting with quicksaving, seemingly totally random, and it didn't happen during any intense battle or anything like that (I even once hit it in the middle of a double-dragon fight, no problems). Also, the quicksave did actually complete it's operation. I.E. when I loaded the game back up the quicksave was in the list unlike in the issue before described. Not only was it in the list, but loadable as well. I think it's safe to call that a "fluke" since it's rare enough, doesn't seem to be incresing in frequency, and I can't be bothered to solve a detail that minor unless it became bigger. So I'll just leave that one.

No framrate drops, no load times that are out of the ordinary, or ILS, one random crash once while loading, but again nothing I'm gonna' fuss about too much.

I did have a problem with Durak briefly, who turned hostile to me for some reason (later figured out it could be some Stendarr Vigilants I murdered because I found them annoying), but I fixed him with console commands and test-started dawnguard (successfully) to be safe, so no issues there.

 

So yeah, nothing that I wasn't experiencing when I first started this game, and if it starts happening again, well I pretty much know the solution. Just thought you guys might like to know. Thanks again for everything guys.