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STEP v2.2.0 Official Bug Reports Thread



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#61 Besidilo

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 05:48 AM

Go to any mod's page.

Find this:

Awesome work, love this mod. Endorsed.

I just checked this mod with TESdump (command line ver of TES5Edit) and it shows a few errors you should know about.


Smile when you see a foot long page of UDRs that the spoiler tag doesn't hide in the Comments of the mod.

You have to look at it through the forums, not the download site. It can't handle even the slightest formatting, so stupid.  Looks gorgeous on the forum.


I know, I've done the same thing. Some authors got a bit upset.
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#62 rpsgc

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 08:51 AM

[quote name=''Besidilo Wrote']I know' date=' I've done the same thing. Some authors got a bit upset.[/quote']

Those who are still around that is... or those that still care (about their mods). Sadly not that many.
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#63 z929669

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 08:43 PM

[quote='rpsgc' pid='13244' dateline='1348235509']
[quote name=''Besidilo Wrote']I know' date=' I've done the same thing. Some authors got a bit upset.[/quote']

Those who are still around that is... or those that still care (about their mods). Sadly not that many.[/quote]
This is evolution by mechanism of "natural pride" selection. Those that are fickle do not last, which serves the modding community best in the long run. The very best mods will stay alive ... and the STEP community is a force to be reckoned with in helping to determine the importance of any given mod (authors can drop out, but others can pick up where they left off).

#64 Nyven

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 07:45 AM

In the step pdf guide I noticed on page 11 you guys are missing the phrase 'VRAM video card' after "1Gb" in the Baseline System hardware list.
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#65 rpsgc

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 08:50 AM

And it's GB, not Gb ;)
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#66 z929669

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 09:15 AM

In the step pdf guide I noticed on page 11 you guys are missing the phrase 'VRAM video card' after "1Gb" in the Baseline System hardware list.

Noted, thanks

#67 TheCompiler

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 10:48 AM

Are you sure BFSEffect and Better Quest Objectives still have errors? The first has been updated and the second doesn't show any UDR/ITM with tes5edit
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#68 Aryube

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 10:52 AM

hi, is the imaginator safe?
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#69 z929669

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 12:53 PM

[quote name=''Aryube' pid='15556' dateline='1353599572']hi' date=' is the imaginator safe?[/quote']
It has a few structural errors, but it should be fine. It looks to have been abandoned since Skyrim v1.6. Please test and let us know :yes:

#70 Korentin

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 02:10 PM

I've not had any problems with it the times I've used it, except for the dialogue bug but that's easily fixed. The author(s) likely won't update it until some new skse functions are implemented from what I've heard.
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#71 Aryube

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 02:27 PM

[quote='z929669' pid='15559' dateline='1353606807']
[quote name=''Aryube' pid='15556' dateline='1353599572']hi' date=' is the imaginator safe?[/quote']
It has a few structural errors, but it should be fine. It looks to have been abandoned since Skyrim v1.6. Please test and let us know :yes:[/quote]
Working fine for me so far ^^
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#72 Nirodha

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 01:12 PM

Are you sure BFSEffect and Better Quest Objectives still have errors? The first has been updated and the second doesn't show any UDR/ITM with tes5edit

I've been concerned about BFS for a while now.  I am getting frequent instability when a storm mage battle breaks out.  At first, I thought it was VRAM bursting, but it happens at 0.7x too.
I greatly appreciate you guys checking these mods for errors.  Keep up the good work.  I'll keep reading.
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#73 TechAngel85

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 05:30 PM

Recently going through STEP and being brand new to modding, I have a few suggestions that might make STEP easier to follow:

My first recommendation is providing more than one version of STEP for different baselines. This could include a "Performance/low-end" version for those with less than great systems (i.e. stock PCs and laptops) that just meet or are slightly more than Skyrim minimum system requirements which would be geared toward providing the best performance. Next could be a "Default/Balanced/Baseline" version consisting of the current baseline and geared toward a balance of performance and quality. The last could be an "Extreme/high-end" version geared to those with high-end systems where performance is not an issue.

Performance Version:
  • Leave INIs as default or even suggest reducing tweaks that increase the shadow resolution. (reducing the default vaules to half in my testing resulted in 3-5FPS increase which could mean meeting the minimum 32FPS or not)
  • Install only core mods with detailed descriptions for which version of mod to install to provide the best possible performance.
  • Explain the ups and downs of using an ENB in terms of performance. ENBs can lead up to 40-50% reduction of FPS. ENB would not be recommended if testing resulted in reductions which lower FPS to under 32FPS. (this info could be added to the wiki page for ENBs )

Balanced Version:
  • Tweak INI settings to double default values to maintain performance. (i.e. 1024=2048, etc)
  • Pretty much leaving STEP as is.
  • Install performance versions of all mods where available.
  • Install optional mods at own discretion as long as the minimum 32FPS is maintained.
  • Installing ENB is optional but recommended. Install best to mid performance options.

Extreme Version:
  • Turn up INI tweaks to their maximum settings for best quality.
  • Install all mods.
  • Install the highest quality mods where available (2048 versions and up)
  • Recommend installing ENB with highest quality options.

Of course the Launcher and video card settings would reflect each version as well. I realize this would be more work but in my opinion it would also streamline STEP for each option available instead of piling everything into one big guide and letting the users sort through and figure out the things they need and don't need which can get confusing for new modders like myself.

GUIDE EDITS
  • In the "Impact" column it is note that the impact of many mods is "FPS" with no other information whether that is an increase or decrease in FPS.
  • Golden God Shrines has multiple options that are not covered. Some break vanilla and possibly immersion.
  • That's Ice mod has multiple options. It might be wise to include in the description the best options as to not break away from Vanilla or immersion.
  • The "WATER" mod description is off. There is no "Get Wet" option. The only options are Reduced Splash, Extra Wet Rocks and Trough Water - Animated.
  • Deadly Spells Impacts have several options that are not covered to maintain vanilla and immersion.
  • Warmer Magic Lights have multiples options that are not covered.
WIKI EDITS
  • In the Mod Testing section of the wiki it might be wise to include a program that can measure FPS, such as FRAPS. FPS is one of the best indicators of overall general performance. If there is already one there please forgive me for overlooking it.
  • In the ENB section of the wiki, it needs to be noted that if shadow striping occurs that increasing the iBlurDeferredShadowMask value in the INI from 2 (what the STEP INI Tweaks changes it to) to a higher value will correct the issue. (this happened when I used Project ENB). This could also be included in the Troubleshooting Guides.
  • The link to the Standalone SMAA on the ENB page is broken. The mod page no longer exists. I'm interested in SMAA because Project ENB doesn't have it. So an alternative that is supported by STEP would be most helpful.

MODS TO BE ADDED
Get Snowy - this has not caused me any issues and adds a realism to the game where snow sticks to the players and NPCs during snow storms. Who can run around in a snow storm and not have an ounce of snow on them?

Thanks for reading!

#74 Farlo

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:21 PM

Recently going through STEP and being brand new to modding, I have a few suggestions that might make STEP easier to follow:

My first recommendation is providing more than one version of STEP for different baselines. This could include a "Performance/low-end" version for those with less than great systems (i.e. stock PCs and laptops) that just meet or are slightly more than Skyrim minimum system requirements which would be geared toward providing the best performance. Next could be a "Default/Balanced/Baseline" version consisting of the current baseline and geared toward a balance of performance and quality. The last could be an "Extreme/high-end" version geared to those with high-end systems where performance is not an issue.

While it's easy to provide a STEP guide for the Baseline and high-end systems, supporting low-end systems is another endeavor entirely.  STEP was originally started to provide the best visual enhancements the community has to offer and as such we've always encouraged users to make the decision to install particular mods on their own.  Keep in mind that STEP is a guide first and only offers our personal preferences (although we try to be as objective as we can).  Starting with v2.3 we'll have a lot more empirical test results to evaluate mods with, but in the end the guide will contain everything we suggest for the best experience.  Because modding can be very machine-specific and individual we merely list our suggestions and leave it up to the user to pick the mods they want to (and can) use.  The Impact column can be a little more helpful (and it hopefully will be in the next version) as far as distinguishing mods that are resource-intensive, but at the end of the day, each user has their own limit as to how much they can add to the game and there's no way we can account for all possible configurations and situations, especially not if we're going to aim for specific framerates (as those can change drastically just based on what you're running in the background).  To that end, I doubt we'll ever release separated guides, but we will always try to provide as much relevant information about a mod as we can so that users can make the best decisions for their system.

Obviously we want to offer optimizations that will benefit everyone, and as far as INI tweaks we can probably suggest different values based on performance, so we'll look at that.  Most mods in STEP that affect FPS are textures, and the reason they do so is because of their resolution and filesize.  This process will be explained a lot better in v2.3, but basically you can simply run DDSopt with a resolution constraint to bring all the STEP mods down to Vanilla resolution, and that will reduce a lot of the impact these mods have on the game (although every texture may not scale down so well and this is something that deserves a forum thread of its own).  The ENB page does need some attention and it'll likely be revamped for v2.3 as we'll be introducing a "Post-Processing Pack" that will offer an array of options for all system and personality types.

I wish I could say "I'll look into those right away", but to be honest we're a lot more focused on building a framework for analyzing and testing mods going forward so unfortunately quite a bit is being left for when that's all done and we're back in mod-testing and guide-writing mode.  

Of course the Launcher and video card settings would reflect each version as well. I realize this would be more work but in my opinion it would also streamline STEP for each option available instead of piling everything into one big guide and letting the users sort through and figure out the things they need and don't need which can get confusing for new modders like myself.

As I said above, we encourage users to make decisions for themselves and look at modding as a learning experience.  Obviously this ideology doesn't work for everyone as some people just want a "plug-and-play" experience with modding.  Unfortunately that's not how Skyrim mods work and attempting to reduce it to that will always fail.  Of course we're looking at ways to make the experience less tedious and one of our admins is working on a program that can fetch mods from the Nexus for you (similar to NMM), that's a long ways off and will still involve the user selecting with mods will be used.  New users definitely don't fall into this category, and the process can seem complex when you're first introduced to it.  To that end, we're looking for ways to make the installation process as easy as extracting the files to a folder and then using a mod manager such as Wrye Bash or Mod Organizer to handle overwrites.  That way new users don't have to deal with installation order and all that while we can leave the door open for more experienced users to experiment on their own.

GUIDE EDITS

  • In the "Impact" column it is note that the impact of many mods is "FPS" with no other information whether that is an increase or decrease in FPS.
  • Golden God Shrines has multiple options that are not covered. Some break vanilla and possibly immersion.
  • That's Ice mod has multiple options. It might be wise to include in the description the best options as to not break away from Vanilla or immersion.
  • The "WATER" mod description is off. There is no "Get Wet" option. The only options are Reduced Splash, Extra Wet Rocks and Trough Water - Animated.
  • Deadly Spells Impacts have several options that are not covered to maintain vanilla and immersion.
  • Warmer Magic Lights have multiples options that are not covered.

As I said above, the Impact column needs some work; that was introduced with good intentions, but there was never enough data to do anything really helpful with it.  As far as the rest: my apologies, it's pretty hard to keep several hundred mod descriptions up-to-date, and some authors may have changed their offerings between guide revisions.  At least before every big STEP release I go through the installation process and make sure everything's there, so most of them should be addressed sooner or later, but if not it's generally one of those "its up to the user to decide which they want" type of deals.  I'll look at these to see if we need to fix anything for v2.2.0b (our next bug-fixing release), and in the mean time if you find any begs or errors in the guide, please post here.

WIKI EDITS

  • In the Mod Testing section of the wiki it might be wise to include a program that can measure FPS, such as FRAPS. FPS is one of the best indicators of overall general performance. If there is already one there please forgive me for overlooking it.
  • In the ENB section of the wiki, it needs to be noted that if shadow striping occurs that increasing the iBlurDeferredShadowMask value in the INI from 2 (what the STEP INI Tweaks changes it to) to a higher value will correct the issue. (this happened when I used Project ENB). This could also be included in the Troubleshooting Guides.
  • The link to the Standalone SMAA on the ENB page is broken. The mod page no longer exists. I'm interested in SMAA because Project ENB doesn't have it. So an alternative that is supported by STEP would be most helpful.

The whole testing section is going to be re-written, that page is quite outdated, and we'll definitely be including a program that monitors FPS, VRAM usage, CPU usage, etc.  As I said above, the ENB page was put together quickly and hasn't been updated in a while.  I'll ask the ENB author who volunteered to write it if they can update it a bit, but besides that it's going to have to wait for v2.3 :(.  Same goes for the SMAA link, I'm not too keen on all the ENB stuff so I don't know where to find an alternative.

MODS TO BE ADDED
Get Snowy - this has not caused me any issues and adds a realism to the game where snow sticks to the players and NPCs during snow storms. Who can run around in a snow storm and not have an ounce of snow on them?

Thanks for reading!

For mod suggestions (and reviews!) remember to use the search tool to find the thread or post about it in the Mod Suggestions forum.  Get Snowy's thead can be found here, and it looks like there haven't been any posts recently.
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#75 TechAngel85

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 06:41 PM

Please forgive the noob misposting mistakes. I'll tune into those sections and read up.Although being a newbie modder, I would much rather install everything manually. This takes a great deal more time but it's a sure fire way to make sure everything installed correctly. I tried NMM and it was having issues installing some mods. Bash would be perfect if they added mod tracking for updates. Thanks again for reading though!



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